Governing Body Appointments

[SlaveForJah]

I had a sister ask me a question that neither she nor I had an answer for. I thought I would ask the board members for any information. Her question was this: How are the Governing Body members appointed?

Thanks all

SlaveForJah

[DoubtingThomas]

Hi SFJ,

Ray Franz touched on that in his book. It is by invitation from those currently serving on the GB. There is not a pre-determined set number of members serving. The only requirement that I have seen in print to serve as a member of the GB is to be annointed for the heavenly calling. Most of those currently serving as GB members have had their story published in the Awake! or WT magazines. Most came from the ranks of Circuit or District Overseers or Branch Overseers or were long time members of the Bethel family working in one of the various departments. Hope that helps.

DT

[SlaveForJah]

Hi SFJ,

Ray Franz touched on that in his book. It is by invitation from those currently serving on the GB. There is not a pre-determined set number of members serving. The only requirement that I have seen in print to serve as a member of tge GB is to be annointed for the heavenly calling. Hope that helps.

DT[/b]

That certainly does help, DT. Thank you for your reply.


Agape

SlaveForJah

[Peter]

What amazes me is the 2/3 vote as the decisions made effect millions of Jehovah’s Witnesses. If what they are deciding is the will of God shouldn’t the vote be unanimous.

I’m sure I’ve seen it somewhere, not all the members of the GB are of the anointed.

[James]

Here is who's who on the GB, present,past and otherwise.

Current (year appointed)

As of April 2007, the current members of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses, in alphabetical order, are:

* Anthony Morris (2005)
* David H. Splane (1999)
* Geoffrey Jackson (2005)
* Gerrit Lösch (1994)
* Guy H. Pierce (1999)
* John E. Barr (1977)
* M. Stephen Lett (1999)
* Samuel F. Herd (1999)
* Theodore Jaracz (1974)


Former (deceased)

* Albert D. Schroeder (1974-2006)
* Carey W. Barber (1977-2007)
* Charles J. Fekel (1974-1977)
* Daniel Sydlik (1974-2006)
* Frederick William Franz (1971-1992) — 4th President of Watchtower Society
* George D. Gangas (1971-1994)
* Grant Suiter (1971-1983)
* John C. Booth (1974-1996)
* John O. Groh (1971-1975)
* Karl F. Klein (1974-2001)
* Lyman Alexander Swingle (1971-2001)
* Martin Pötzinger (1977-1988)
* Milton George Henschel (1971-2003) — 5th President of Watchtower Society
* Nathan Homer Knorr (1942-1977) — 3rd President of Watchtower Society
* Thomas J. Sullivan (1971-1974)
* William K. Jackson (1971-1981)
* William Lloyd Barry (1974-1999)

Resigned / Removed

* Ewart Chitty (1974-1978)
* Raymond Franz (1971-1980)
* Leo K. Greenlees (1971-1984)

agape,
James

[DoubtingThomas]

Franz mentioned in his book that decisions are rarely unanimous by the GB Peter. That is the book that really opened my eyes to the internal disharmony on the inside of the organization that few of JW's know about. In fact, as Franz described it, quite often the monthly meetings (the first Wednesday of every month the GB members have their meetings in Brooklyn) are contentious with much debate and bickering and politicing as he described it. It turned Franz off, that is for sure. It is really sad that he turned apostate and left the truth. He could have been an asset for the organization IMHO. The 2/3 majority vote has to do with changing any existing policy (according to Franz) and not the implementing of new policies.

Unless the requirements have recently changed, it has always been a requirement to be one of the annointed to serve on the GB. That has been printed in our publications in the past. I am not aware of any changes. But several years ago, when the GB members stepped down from serving on the Board of Directors of the Watchtower Corp. and Don Adams became the new President of the WT, is when the change was made to allow members of the earthly class to take over the day-to-day legal duties of the Watchtower Corporation. Don Adams is not of the annointed. That may be what you are thinking of Peter. But the GB members are still the ones in charge pulling the strings and pushing the buttons (behind the curtain) in the ivory towers.

DT

[billy]

"It is really sad that he turned apostate "

why do you think he turned apostate?

[Peter]

As for Franz it worth typing his mame into u-tube. Does any know if it’s possible to get hold of a PDF version of ‘Crises of Conscience? </span>

[Peter]

That may sound contradictory calling him an apostate and wanting to read his book, :o but Franz is one of the few who has first hand experience at Bethel and the GB.

[DoubtingThomas]

To answer your question billy, when I say that Franz turned apostate, I mean that he now believes that all Christians are going to heaven. not just the 144K. He has apostasized against this clear scriptural teaching, not just against the teachings of JW&#39;s.

DT

[DoubtingThomas]

Most of the GB are university educated, what happens when none of the anointed qualify at that level. For the most part they are unlettered and ordinary, so will they turn to those ones or will they look further afield to the Great crowd or society men? [/b]


I was unaware of that Peter. Are you sure? I mean, which one of the 9 current GB members have a university education? This was not mentioned in any of their life stories that I have read. I was just curious. Thanks for your reply.

DT

[Peter]

I have read that one of their sons Benjamin who lived at Bethel was sent to university to study political science, if its true talk about a rule for one and not for the other.

[DoubtingThomas]

Brother Losch (A GB Member) was at our Special Assembly Day a few weeks ago in Reno, Nevada (USA). If I would have been aware of the fact that several GB members had a university education, I would have said something to him about that. I have a reputation for being a "trouble maker" already, so I might as well continue to live up to my undeserved (IMO) reputation.

[billy]

To answer your question billy, when I say that Franz turned apostate, I mean that he now believes that all Christians are going to heaven. not just the 144K. He has apostasized against this clear scriptural teaching, not just against the teachings of JW&#39;s.

DT[/b]

He didnt say that in his book "Crisis of Conscience" - the book was great - i think every JW should read it - I didnt get the impression at all he had gone apostate - he just didnt agree with everything the wto does - and some of the other members of the gb agreed with him but caved under policitical pressure - i had been suffering from a crisis myself and reading his book made me feel mentally sane - i dont want to follow the man - i just agree with his conclusions and now see how the wto works and understand why there is such a lack of love in the org because the leaders arent setting the example like Jesus did - it seems to me the wto is heading down the road of apostasy by encouraging abuse in families, physical, emotional, mental and sexual among other disgusting things - i didnt see franz promoting those things????

[billy]

</span>

As for Franz it worth typing his mame into u-tube. Does any know if it&#39;s possible to get hold of a PDF version of &#39;Crises of Conscience? </span>[/b]


<span style="color:#0000ff">there are 4 chapters available from the "Crisis of Conscience" book on line

[Jinnvisible]

http://www.silentlambs.org/personal_experi...s/RayFranz1.cfm (http://www.silentlambs.org/personal_experiences/RayFranz1.cfm)

http://www.silentlambs.org/personal_experi...s/RayFranz2.cfm (http://www.silentlambs.org/personal_experiences/RayFranz2.cfm)

Ray Franz experiences are interesting it would be a bit strange if they weren`t as he was a governing body member. Bill Bowen is also a prominant watchtower exile. Bill Bowen has made some of his own mistakes during the time that he has been running his opperation.

I find Bowen&#39;s annalysis of Franz&#39;s comminication quite revealing. Some formerly associated with the watchtower society write thier stories and post them on the internet, yet they wouldn`t have the success that Franz has had if they were selling a book because of Franz&#39;s prominance in the organisation.

Franz&#39;s position also gives him more culpabillity than others because of his former position. Yet he seems a bit shy of wanting to accept that. The doctrinal and procedural arguments are one thing yet when it comes to the leaven that allowed child molestation to exist in order to provide a whiter than white image, rather than honestestly admitting these things can happen among Jehovah`s witnesses Franz seems to shy away and defend himself rather that concern himself with the suffering of those victims.

Its a nobel thing to accept martyrdom, Ray Franz - like Jesus - sold out by his own people. It may also be quite a romantic notion if unlike Jesus avaling yourself from responcibillity is the foremost concern.

Ray Franz may not be quite as much of an apostate as he is made out to be, yet he still appears to exhibit the same traits of self absorbed concern that are such a problem with the leadership of the watchtower organisation today.

[Peter]

It would be interesting to unearth out what Franz thinks of e-watchman :wacko:

[billy]

It just goes to show you cant let other people do your thinking for you - many have revealed hidden secrects with in the org - the truth will keep coming out - from many different sources - its good to see truth prevailing and keeps us on our toes not to follow man - wether it is Ray, Bill, Robert or the GB but Jesus who represents truth, justice and righteousness

child molestation seems to be an issue given alot of attention in the last 10 years - before that i think it was kept very secret - in families, organizations and religions - here in Australia the stolen generation of Aboriginals - where many children were taken away from their families to live in institutions or white families from the late nineteenth-century to the late 1960s - only recently has there been given much attention to the sexual abuse that was perpetrated on these children by the carers - I think hidden secrets began to be revealed starting in the 60&#39;s when a generation of people began to rebel against the system and expose much of what had been going on - the facts are becoming more out in the open now and the issue is actually being disscussed and dealt with - although i dont see any information on how to treat the abusers - it&#39;s one thing to expose the problem but what about the solution?

[vonstauffenberg]

I feel disappointed. I thought jehovah chose the 144000, even jesus said that it was a position which he couldnt grant (mark 10:40 matt 20:20-21,23), it looks like man made rules, and a university education...isnt that being part of the world? and political science??? the pharisees recognized jesus hadnt been to the rabbinic schools, so how is this waliking in jesus&#39; steps?
And remember jehovah chooses the foolish things of the world to put the wise of the world to shame. I feel disappointd, it has bothered me for ages how the 144000 are chosen, and as the bible says, its not sealed yet, until the time of the end.
Can anybody help me?

[Nightflyer]

Btw, I don&#39;t think just *any* of the remnant will be chosen to serve in the GB. I&#39;m sure the GB doesn&#39;t want to choose any "independent thinkers" or dissidents there - I&#39;m sure they confirm beforehand that the candidates are no any kind of "reformers" or trouble-makers... in reality this means that they choose their long-time-buddies who they personally know very well.

[Jeshurun]

I&#39;m sure they confirm beforehand that the candidates are no any kind of "reformers" or trouble-makers... in reality this means that they choose their long-time-buddies who they personally know very well.[/b]

Do you mean like they do in secret societies? :0095:

:191:

Jesh

[Berean]

<div class='quotemain'>I&#39;m sure they confirm beforehand that the candidates are no any kind of "reformers" or trouble-makers... in reality this means that they choose their long-time-buddies who they personally know very well.[/b]

Do you mean like they do in secret societies? :0095:

:191:

Jesh
[/b][/quote]
Or the Roman Catholic Church, to name just another example.

[Candace]

I feel disappointed. I thought jehovah chose the 144000, even jesus said that it was a position which he couldnt grant (mark 10:40 matt 20:20-21,23), it looks like man made rules, and a university education...isnt that being part of the world? and political science??? the pharisees recognized jesus hadnt been to the rabbinic schools, so how is this waliking in jesus&#39; steps?
And remember jehovah chooses the foolish things of the world to put the wise of the world to shame. I feel disappointd, it has bothered me for ages how the 144000 are chosen, and as the bible says, its not sealed yet, until the time of the end.
Can anybody help me?[/b]

Good point! Jehovah does the choosing. When Jehovah pours out his spirit on the anointed ones, we will have no doubt who was chosen.

(Acts 2:17-21) . . .‘“And in the last days,” God says, “I shall pour out some of my spirit upon every sort of flesh, and YOUR sons and YOUR daughters will prophesy and YOUR young men will see visions and YOUR old men will dream dreams; 18 and even upon my men slaves and upon my women slaves I will pour out some of my spirit in those days, and they will prophesy. 19 And I will give portents in heaven above and signs on earth below, blood and fire and smoke mist; 20 the sun will be turned into darkness and the moon into blood before the great and illustrious day of Jehovah arrives. 21 And everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved.”’

[scriptures]

<div class='quotemain'>I feel disappointed. I thought jehovah chose the 144000, even jesus said that it was a position which he couldnt grant (mark 10:40 matt 20:20-21,23), it looks like man made rules, and a university education...isnt that being part of the world? and political science??? the pharisees recognized jesus hadnt been to the rabbinic schools, so how is this waliking in jesus&#39; steps?
And remember jehovah chooses the foolish things of the world to put the wise of the world to shame. I feel disappointd, it has bothered me for ages how the 144000 are chosen, and as the bible says, its not sealed yet, until the time of the end.
Can anybody help me?[/b]

Good point! Jehovah does the choosing. When Jehovah pours out his spirit on the anointed ones, we will have no doubt who was chosen.

(Acts 2:17-21) . . .&#39;"And in the last days," God says, "I shall pour out some of my spirit upon every sort of flesh, and YOUR sons and YOUR daughters will prophesy and YOUR young men will see visions and YOUR old men will dream dreams; 18 and even upon my men slaves and upon my women slaves I will pour out some of my spirit in those days, and they will prophesy. 19 And I will give portents in heaven above and signs on earth below, blood and fire and smoke mist; 20 the sun will be turned into darkness and the moon into blood before the great and illustrious day of Jehovah arrives. 21 And everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved."&#39;

[/b][/quote]

I don&#39;t understand these things......

[Sketch]

Current (year appointed)
As of April 2007, the current members of the Governing Body of Jehovah&#39;s Witnesses, in alphabetical order, are:

* Anthony Morris (2005)
* David H. Splane (1999)
* Geoffrey Jackson (2005)
* Gerrit Lösch (1994)
* Guy H. Pierce (1999)
* John E. Barr (1977)
* M. Stephen Lett (1999)
* Samuel F. Herd (1999)
* Theodore Jaracz (1974)[/b]

I know this might be a touchy question for some, but seeing as how women are among the annointed, has a woman EVER been on the GB? that still makes no sense to me...

Where are de&#39;womens?
http://img.timeinc.net/time/daily/2007/0701/borat_lebanon0109.jpg

[watchman]

I know this might be a touchy question for some, but seeing as how women are among the annointed, has a woman EVER been on the GB? that still makes no sense to me...[/b]


One of the requirements is that a candidate must be an older man. That might present a problem for most women. :icon_neutral:

Watchman

[SlaveForJah]

<div class='quotemain'>I know this might be a touchy question for some, but seeing as how women are among the annointed, has a woman EVER been on the GB? that still makes no sense to me...[/b]


One of the requirements is that a candidate must be an older man. That might present a problem for most women. :icon_neutral:

Watchman
[/b][/quote]

Just a thought, but WHY is this (gender) a requirement for the Governing Body?


Agape

SlaveForJah

[Jinnvisible]

Just a thought, but WHY is this (gender) a requirement for the Governing Body?


Agape

SlaveForJah[/b]

It`s no doubt from Paul`s direction on general congregational teaching.

With the grand irony being that Paul might consider the entire leadership to be acting like a bunch of women, in regard to thier fearing of bad public relations above thier fear of perpitrating injustice. Its like they are concerned that thier shoes don`t match thier handbags. The details, not the weightier matters.

As far as women being the weaker vessel strength does not alway equate influence. Women are hugely influencial and in ways that are not always overtly obvious.

[SlaveForJah]

<div class='quotemain'>Just a thought, but WHY is this (gender) a requirement for the Governing Body?


Agape

SlaveForJah[/b]

It`s no doubt from Paul`s direction on general congregational teaching.

With the grand irony being that Paul might consider the entire leadership to be acting like a bunch of women, in regard to thier fearing of bad public relations above thier fear of perpitrating injustice. Its like they are concerned that thier shoes don`t match thier handbags. The details, not the weightier matters.

As far as women being the weaker vessel strength does not alway equate influence. Women are hugely influencial and in ways that are not always overtly obvious.
[/b][/quote]

I realize that Paul did not allow women to "teach". Would a Governing Body spot necessarily be one of "teaching"? Where would Junia and Deborah fit in?


Agape

SlaveForJah

[Jinnvisible]

Would a Governing Body spot necessarily be one of "teaching"?[/b]

<div align="left">***[/b] w71 12/15 pp. 755-756 A Governing Body as Different from a Legal Corporation ***</div>
<div align="left"><span style="color:#008000">The true Christian congregation was established on the festival day of Pentecost of the year 33 C.E. at Jerusalem in the Roman province of Judea. On that notable day this congregation of dedicated Christians, consisting then of about 120 members, was anointed with holy spirit, which Jehovah God poured out upon them through the glorified Jesus Christ. This anointed body of dedicated, baptized Christians was then given a special assignment of service. According to the prophetic words of Jesus Christ at Matthew 24:45-47, it was given the appointment as the "faithful and discreet slave." The now heavenly Jesus Christ was the Master and Lord of this anointed "slave" class.</div>
<div align="left">The Bible book, Acts of Apostles, discloses that this anointed Christian congregation as a "slave" class had a visible, earthly governing body. On that day of Pentecost it was composed of twelve men, namely, the twelve apostles of the Lord Jesus Christ. Years later, about the year 49 C.E., this governing body was reported to include the then surviving apostles of Christ and the spiritual elders of the Jerusalem congregation. (Acts, chapter 15) This Christian governing body did not use as an administrative agency any legal corporation recognized, authorized and chartered by Caesar or any province of the Roman Empire. The decree issued was written up and carried by personal messengers to the Christian congregations that were concerned because of the non-Jewish or Gentile converts among them. The Christian apostle John, who wrote the last books of the Holy Bible toward the close of the first century C.E., was apparently the last surviving member of the original governing body appointed by Jesus Christ.</div>
</span></span></span>

[FaithfulJW]

http://www.tiptopwebsite.com/photos3/brotherlaurance/Governing-Body.jpg

[arimatthewdavies]

im in no way mocking with this qustion. let us say the g.b are all anointed,im not talking about 144000 im talking holy spirit to lead anointed. since they are the top elders of the congregation does that not fit the description of apostleship? or were jesus apostles the onley real apostles?

[Nightflyer]

im in no way mocking with this qustion. let us say the g.b are all anointed,im not talking about 144000 im talking holy spirit to lead anointed. since they are the top elders of the congregation does that not fit the description of apostleship? or were jesus apostles the onley real apostles?

The apostles were chosen by the Son of God himself - so these "top elders" of our time cant be compared to them in any way. The GB members are chosen by themselves! I mean that the current GB members decide about the new members. It has been said for example, that the newest 7 members (who you can see in the photo above: Herd, Lett, Losch, Pierce, Splane, Morris and Jackson) were "hand-picked" by Jaracz, who is considered to be the Boss of GB. Barber, Schroeder and Sydlik have already passed away.

[Jinnvisible]

im in no way mocking with this qustion. let us say the g.b are all anointed,im not talking about 144000 im talking holy spirit to lead anointed. since they are the top elders of the congregation does that not fit the description of apostleship? or were jesus apostles the onley real apostles?

Hi ari.

What you are talking about is something called `apostolic succession`. It has been widely considered for hundreds of years. Presently some religious groups claim it. Others do not.

Roman Catholisism claims it with the station of `Pope`. That position is considered the office of the apostle Peter and anyone who takes that office is therefore successor or hier to apostleship. There are other kinds of cathiolisism whioch are not actualy papal ( papal pronounced `Pape - AL` not `paypal` like your buying a toaster from e-bay) and reject, the pointy hat man that looks like a klans man.

The watchtower society theologically refutes the ideology of apostolic succession. That is to say they believe you can have men `taking the lead` yet on paper their is no official successor to the office of apostle. Which means being a close freind of Jesus as one of his `inner circle` was something more specific to his times. Although Incidentlly the gospel writter Luke is said not to have been an eyewitness to Gospel events I`m not sure why that is. In their day there was a kind of apostolic replacement that is the apostles replaced one of thier own number, albiet before thier annointing.

So officially the governing body do not claim apostleship. Whether thier actions claim it is another matter. For instance there does not seem to be a recorded incident where the pharasees officially claimed to be Moses successor, yet Jesus stated that they had claimed it apparently by thier posturing and behaviour within the covenant nation.

[Utuna]

Hi ari.

What you are talking about is something called `apostolic succession`. It has been widely considered for hundreds of years. Presently some religious groups claim it. Others do not.

Roman Catholisism claims it with the station of `Pope`. That position is considered the office of the apostle Peter and anyone who takes that office is therefore successor or hier to apostleship. There are other kinds of cathiolisism whioch are not actualy papal ( papal pronounced `Pape - AL` not `paypal` like your buying a toaster from e-bay) and reject, the pointy hat man that looks like a klans man.

The watchtower society theologically refutes the ideology of apostolic succession. That is to say they believe you can have men `taking the lead` yet on paper their is no official successor to the office of apostle. Which means being a close freind of Jesus as one of his `inner circle` was something more specific to his times. Although Incidentlly the gospel writter Luke is said not to have been an eyewitness to Gospel events I`m not sure why that is. In their day there was a kind of apostolic replacement that is the apostles replaced one of thier own number, albiet before thier annointing.

So officially the governing body do not claim apostleship. Whether thier actions claim it is another matter. For instance there does not seem to be a recorded incident where the pharasees officially claimed to be Moses successor, yet Jesus stated that they had claimed it apparently by thier posturing and behaviour within the covenant nation.

Dear Jinn,

You're right! And what I have understood from their "coup d'état" awkwardly explained in the WT article, they imply that they are the body of elders of their anointed brothers and by implication, of the whole organization. That's totally unscriptural, all the more so that the b/s under their aegis must keep submissive and mute... for fear of being disfellowshipped without further ado.

---------------------------------------------------
"Le sectarisme des jugements pauvres lui tenait quelquefois lieu de volonté" - Hervé Bazin
"J'ai pétri de la boue et j'en ai fait de l'or" - Charles Baudelaire
"S'il m'a été donné de voir un peu plus loin que les autres, c'est que je me tenais sur les épaules de géants" - Isaac Newton

[uglyandthin]

Hi All:

My question is...is there an honest heart among them? Or, are they just a bunch of yes men?

uglyandthin

[TheMdC]

Anyone know which of them, if any, are currently married?
If so, what's the scoop on their wife and family situations?

[imjustaskin]

And does anyone know whatever happened to the one with the stroke? Has there been any new info recently?

[Anthony]

3 ........................

[JB]

I dont understand who appoints them. I mean I belive I understand correctly that Jehovah chooses them? But how do they know this? I think I read in a WT sometime about how they just know they are appointed, and people like me just know that I'm not. I don't know how to explain my thoughts on this, but say I study for a few years and I get the feeling I'm of the annoited, will they believe me?? Or just say foolish man their is NO way you could be.

Sorry if I confuse you all with my blabber sometimes I have a hard time with getting my point across with words in writing.:confused:

Anybody that understands what i'm trying to say, is welcome to explain this to me.

[TheMdC]

I dont understand who appoints them. I mean I belive I understand correctly that Jehovah chooses them? But how do they know this? I think I read in a WT sometime about how they just know they are appointed, and people like me just know that I'm not. I don't know how to explain my thoughts on this, but say I study for a few years and I get the feeling I'm of the annoited, will they believe me?? Or just say foolish man their is NO way you could be.

Sorry if I confuse you all with my blabber sometimes I have a hard time with getting my point across with words in writing.:confused:

Anybody that understands what i'm trying to say, is welcome to explain this to me.

If you're asking about the Governing Body in particular, the 9 men who rule the Watchtower organization, then the answer is that they are chosen by themselves. If the 9 brothers feel they want to add a 10th, they nominate and vote on someone among themselves. I don't know how the very first Governing Body was chosen but I think I recall it simply being the board of directors of the Watchtower Corporation.

As for the 144,000 anointed, they are chosen by Holy Spirit. How do they know they've been invited? They just know. I have only met a few anointed in my life but none of them could really explain it in any other way. The Bible explains it in Romans chapter 8 but it isn't any more clear. It is one of those things that if it isn't you, you just don't get it, I think.

[Nightflyer]

If you're asking about the Governing Body in particular, the 9 men who rule the Watchtower organization, then the answer is that they are chosen by themselves. If the 9 brothers feel they want to add a 10th, they nominate and vote on someone among themselves. I don't know how the very first Governing Body was chosen but I think I recall it simply being the board of directors of the Watchtower Corporation.


This is correct. Nowadays its the GB members who decide about possible new GB members.

But back in the 60s there was just the Board of Directors that consisted of 7 members. The term Governing body was very rarely used then, it was all about the President of the Society (who at that time was Nathan Knorr, the vice-president Fred Franz had very important role in doctrinal matters though). In 1971 the GB really came to existence when 4 members were added to these 7 members. Then they really started to use the term GB. But it was not until in 1976 that the GB got the real power (from the president, though Knorr and Fred Franz tried to stop this) when the 6 committees of the GB were formed (Writing committee, service committee etc).

More info about this change in 1976 can be found in my earlier thread: http://e-jehovahs-witnesses.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3463

[Anthony]

Matthew 22:14 “For there are many invited, but few chosen.”


Is this verse referring to the 144,000?

If so, would if be fair to say that those who partake because they feel that they have be called are not really of the anointed as of yet?

The way the verse reads to me is that many more than a 144,000 will be called, but in the end only 144,000 will be chosen. And it doesn’t seem to me that the only cause for not being chosen would mean that you proved to be unfaithful at some point, but just that you were not chosen when narrowing it down to the final 144,000.

[Utuna]

Matthew 22:14“For there are many invited, but few chosen.”

Is this verse referring to the 144,000?

If so, would if be fair to say that those who partake because they feel that they have be called are not really of the anointed as of yet?

The way the verse reads to me is that many more than a 144,000 will be called, but in the end only 144,000 will be chosen. And it doesn’t seem to me that the only cause for not being chosen would mean that you proved to be unfaithful at some point, but just that you were not chosen when narrowing it down to the final 144,000.

Dear Anthony,

That illustration is about the guests of the marriage feast. The anointed ones are the bride, and the slaves, the prophets of old. The city destroyed in verse 7 might well be Jerusalem destroyed because the Jews as a whole didn't care about the marriage feast (v.5-6).

In conclusion, in my opinion, after the destruction of Jerusalem, the "chosen" ones of verse 14 aren't the anointed ones but are the earthly part of God's organization that will support the bride and join the marriage feast properly dressed. The slaves might well be the angels guiding, in one way or another, the preaching work of the Good News as Jesus told his disciples. I'm not saying that the slaves are the anointed ones because they are the bride.

Feel free to correct me if you think that I'm wrong! ;)

However, Mat22:14 can also to applied to anointed ones because many will be invited but, unfortunately, many will fail because of countless personal reasons or snares set by Satan.

---------------------------------------------------
"Le sectarisme des jugements pauvres lui tenait quelquefois lieu de volonté" - Hervé Bazin
"J'ai pétri de la boue et j'en ai fait de l'or" - Charles Baudelaire
"S'il m'a été donné de voir un peu plus loin que les autres, c'est que je me tenais sur les épaules de géants" - Isaac Newton

[Utuna]

Dear all,

I'm currently reading again a book about Holy Spirit. I've read that sentence and please, tell me what you think about it:

"Chantry reminds us that it is because of the forsaking of the supreme authority of Scriptures that the Roman Church was led to set up the visions of the saints and the decrees of the Pope as elevated as the biblical revelation itself".

---------------------------------------------------
"Le sectarisme des jugements pauvres lui tenait quelquefois lieu de volonté" - Hervé Bazin
"J'ai pétri de la boue et j'en ai fait de l'or" - Charles Baudelaire
"S'il m'a été donné de voir un peu plus loin que les autres, c'est que je me tenais sur les épaules de géants" - Isaac Newton