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Berean
04-03-2008, 11:26 AM
Luke 10:1-42

1 After these things the Lord designated seventy others and sent them forth by twos in advance of him into every city and place to which he himself was going to come. 2 Then he began to say to them: “The harvest, indeed, is great, but the workers are few. Therefore beg the Master of the harvest to send out workers into his harvest. 3 Go forth. Look! I am sending YOU forth as lambs in among wolves. 4 Do not carry a purse, nor a food pouch, nor sandals, and do not embrace anybody in greeting along the road. 5 Wherever YOU enter into a house say first, ‘May this house have peace.’ 6 And if a friend of peace is there, YOUR peace will rest upon him. But if there is not, it will turn back to YOU. 7 So stay in that house, eating and drinking the things they provide, for the worker is worthy of his wages. Do not be transferring from house to house.

8 “Also, wherever YOU enter into a city and they receive YOU, eat the things set before YOU, 9 and cure the sick ones in it, and go on telling them, ‘The kingdom of God has come near to YOU.’ 10 But wherever YOU enter into a city and they do not receive YOU, go out into its broad ways and say, 11 ‘Even the dust that got stuck to our feet from YOUR city we wipe off against YOU. Nevertheless, keep this in mind, that the kingdom of God has come near.’ 12 I tell YOU that it will be more endurable for Sod´om in that day than for that city.

13 “Woe to you, Cho·ra´zin! Woe to you, Beth·sa´i·da! because if the powerful works that have taken place in YOU had taken place in Tyre and Si´don, they would long ago have repented sitting in sackcloth and ashes. 14 Consequently it will be more endurable for Tyre and Si´don in the judgment than for YOU. 15 And you, Ca·per´na·um, will you perhaps be exalted to heaven? Down to Ha´des you will come!

16 “He that listens to YOU listens to me [too]. And he that disregards YOU disregards me [too]. Moreover, he that disregards me disregards [also] him that sent me forth.”

17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying: “Lord, even the demons are made subject to us by the use of your name.” 18 At that he said to them: “I began to behold Satan already fallen like lightning from heaven. 19 Look! I have given YOU the authority to trample underfoot serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing will by any means do YOU hurt. 20 Nevertheless, do not rejoice over this, that the spirits are made subject to YOU, but rejoice because YOUR names have been inscribed in the heavens.” 21 In that very hour he became overjoyed in the holy spirit and said: “I publicly praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have carefully hidden these things from wise and intellectual ones, and have revealed them to babes. Yes, O Father, because to do thus came to be the way approved by you. 22 All things have been delivered to me by my Father, and who the Son is no one knows but the Father; and who the Father is, no one [knows] but the Son, and he to whom the Son is willing to reveal him.”

23 With that he turned to the disciples by themselves and said: “Happy are the eyes that behold the things YOU are beholding. 24 For I say to YOU, Many prophets and kings desired to see the things YOU are beholding but did not see them, and to hear the things YOU are hearing but did not hear them.”

25 Now, look! a certain man versed in the Law rose up, to test him out, and said: “Teacher, by doing what shall I inherit everlasting life?” 26 He said to him: “What is written in the Law? How do you read?” 27 In answer he said: “‘You must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole strength and with your whole mind,’ and, ‘your neighbor as yourself.’” 28 He said to him: “You answered correctly; ‘keep on doing this and you will get life.’”

29 But, wanting to prove himself righteous, the man said to Jesus: “Who really is my neighbor?” 30 In reply Jesus said: “A certain man was going down from Jerusalem to Jer´i·cho and fell among robbers, who both stripped him and inflicted blows, and went off, leaving him half-dead. 31 Now, by coincidence, a certain priest was going down over that road, but, when he saw him, he went by on the opposite side. 32 Likewise, a Levite also, when he got down to the place and saw him, went by on the opposite side. 33 But a certain Sa·mar´i·tan traveling the road came upon him and, at seeing him, he was moved with pity. 34 So he approached him and bound up his wounds, pouring oil and wine upon them. Then he mounted him upon his own beast and brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 And the next day he took out two de·nar´i·i, gave them to the innkeeper, and said, ‘Take care of him, and whatever you spend besides this, I will repay you when I come back here.’ 36 Who of these three seems to you to have made himself neighbor to the man that fell among the robbers?” 37 He said: “The one that acted mercifully toward him.” Jesus then said to him: “Go your way and be doing the same yourself.”

38 Now as they were going their way he entered into a certain village. Here a certain woman named Martha received him as guest into the house. 39 This woman also had a sister called Mary, who, however, sat down at the feet of the Lord and kept listening to his word. 40 Martha, on the other hand, was distracted with attending to many duties. So, she came near and said: “Lord, does it not matter to you that my sister has left me alone to attend to things? Tell her, therefore, to join in helping me.” 41 In answer the Lord said to her: “Martha, Martha, you are anxious and disturbed about many things. 42 A few things, though, are needed, or just one. For her part, Mary chose the good portion, and it will not be taken away from her.”

Luke 11:1-54

1 Now on the occasion of his being in a certain place praying, when he stopped, a certain one of his disciples said to him: “Lord, teach us how to pray, just as John also taught his disciples.”

2 Then he said to them: “Whenever YOU pray, say, ‘Father, let your name be sanctified. Let your kingdom come. 3 Give us our bread for the day according to the day’s requirement. 4 And forgive us our sins, for we ourselves also forgive everyone that is in debt to us; and do not bring us into temptation.’”

5 Further, he said to them: “Who of YOU will have a friend and will go to him at midnight and say to him, ‘Friend, loan me three loaves, 6 because a friend of mine has just come to me on a journey and I have nothing to set before him’? 7 And that one from inside says in reply, ‘Quit making me trouble. The door is already locked, and my young children are with me in bed; I cannot rise up and give you anything.’ 8 I tell YOU, Although he will not rise up and give him anything because of being his friend, certainly because of his bold persistence he will get up and give him what things he needs. 9 Accordingly I say to YOU, Keep on asking, and it will be given YOU; keep on seeking, and YOU will find; keep on knocking, and it will be opened to YOU. 10 For everyone asking receives, and everyone seeking finds, and to everyone knocking it will be opened. 11 Indeed, which father is there among YOU who, if his son asks for a fish, will perhaps hand him a serpent instead of a fish? 12 Or if he also asks for an egg, will hand him a scorpion? 13 Therefore, if YOU, although being wicked, know how to give good gifts to YOUR children, how much more so will the Father in heaven give holy spirit to those asking him!”

14 Later he was expelling a dumb demon. After the demon came out, the dumb man spoke. And the crowds marveled. 15 But certain ones of them said: “He expels the demons by means of Be·el´ze·bub the ruler of the demons.” 16 However, others, to tempt him, began seeking a sign out of heaven from him. 17 Knowing their imaginations he said to them: “Every kingdom divided against itself comes to desolation, and a house [divided] against itself falls. 18 So if Satan is also divided against himself, how will his kingdom stand? Because YOU say I expel the demons by means of Be·el´ze·bub. 19 If it is by means of Be·el´ze·bub I expel the demons, by whom do YOUR sons expel them? Because of this they will be judges of YOU. 20 But if it is by means of God’s finger I expel the demons, the kingdom of God has really overtaken YOU. 21 When a strong man, well armed, guards his palace, his belongings continue in peace. 22 But when someone stronger than he is comes against him and conquers him, he takes away his full armament in which he was trusting, and he divides out the things he despoiled him of. 23 He that is not on my side is against me, and he that does not gather with me scatters.

24 “When an unclean spirit comes out of a man, it passes through parched places in search of a resting-place, and, after finding none, it says, ‘I will return to my house out of which I moved.’ 25 And on arriving it finds it swept clean and adorned. 26 Then it goes its way and takes along seven different spirits more wicked than itself, and, after getting inside, they dwell there; and the final circumstances of that man become worse than the first.”

27 Now as he was saying these things a certain woman out of the crowd raised her voice and said to him: “Happy is the womb that carried you and the breasts that you sucked!” 28 But he said: “No, rather, Happy are those hearing the word of God and keeping it!”

29 When the crowds were massing together, he started to say: “This generation is a wicked generation; it looks for a sign. But no sign will be given it except the sign of Jo´nah. 30 For just as Jo´nah became a sign to the Nin´e·vites, in the same way will the Son of man be also to this generation. 31 The queen of the south will be raised up in the judgment with the men of this generation and will condemn them; because she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Sol´o·mon, but, look! something more than Sol´o·mon is here. 32 The men of Nin´e·veh will rise in the judgment with this generation and will condemn it; because they repented at what Jo´nah preached; but, look! something more than Jo´nah is here. 33 After lighting a lamp, a person puts it, not in a vault nor under a measuring basket, but upon the lampstand, that those stepping in may behold the light. 34 The lamp of the body is your eye. When your eye is simple, your whole body is also bright; but when it is wicked, your body is also dark. 35 Be alert, therefore. Perhaps the light that is in you is darkness. 36 Therefore, if your whole body is bright with no part at all dark, it will all be as bright as when a lamp gives you light by its rays.”

37 When he had spoken this, a Pharisee requested him to dine with him. So he went in and reclined at the table. 38 However, the Pharisee was surprised at seeing that he did not first wash before the dinner. 39 But the Lord said to him: “Now YOU Pharisees, YOU cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but the inside of YOU is full of plunder and wickedness. 40 Unreasonable persons! He that made the outside made also the inside, did he not? 41 Nevertheless, give as gifts of mercy the things that are inside, and, look! all [other] things are clean about YOU. 42 But woe to YOU Pharisees, because YOU give the tenth of the mint and the rue and of every [other] vegetable, but YOU pass by the justice and the love of God! These things YOU were under obligation to do, but those other things not to omit. 43 Woe to YOU Pharisees, because YOU love the front seats in the synagogues and the greetings in the marketplaces! 44 Woe to YOU, because YOU are as those memorial tombs which are not in evidence, so that men walk upon them and do not know [it]!”

45 In answer a certain one of those versed in the Law said to him: “Teacher, in saying these things you also insult us.” 46 Then he said: “Woe also to YOU who are versed in the Law, because YOU load men with loads hard to be borne, but YOU yourselves do not touch the loads with one of YOUR fingers!

47 “Woe to YOU, because YOU build the memorial tombs of the prophets, but YOUR forefathers killed them! 48 Certainly YOU are witnesses of the deeds of YOUR forefathers and yet YOU give consent to them, because these killed the prophets but YOU are building [their tombs]. 49 On this account the wisdom of God also said, ‘I will send forth to them prophets and apostles, and they will kill and persecute some of them, 50 so that the blood of all the prophets spilled from the founding of the world may be required from this generation, 51 from the blood of Abel down to the blood of Zech·a·ri´ah, who was slain between the altar and the house.’ Yes, I tell YOU, it will be required from this generation.

52 “Woe to YOU who are versed in the Law, because YOU took away the key of knowledge; YOU yourselves did not go in, and those going in YOU hindered!”

53 So when he went out from there the scribes and the Pharisees started in to press upon him terribly and to ply him with questions about further things, 54 lying in wait for him, to catch something out of his mouth.

Luke 12:1-59

1 In the meantime, when the crowd had gathered together in so many thousands that they were stepping upon one another, he started out by saying first to his disciples: “Watch out for the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy. 2 But there is nothing carefully concealed that will not be revealed, and secret that will not become known. 3 Wherefore what things YOU say in the darkness will be heard in the light, and what YOU whisper in private rooms will be preached from the housetops. 4 Moreover, I say to YOU, my friends, Do not fear those who kill the body and after this are not able to do anything more. 5 But I will indicate to YOU whom to fear: Fear him who after killing has authority to throw into Ge·hen´na. Yes, I tell YOU, fear this One. 6 Five sparrows sell for two coins of small value, do they not? Yet not one of them goes forgotten before God. 7 But even the hairs of YOUR heads are all numbered. Have no fear; YOU are worth more than many sparrows.

8 “I say, then, to YOU, Everyone that confesses union with me before men, the Son of man will also confess union with him before the angels of God. 9 But he that disowns me before men will be disowned before the angels of God. 10 And everyone that says a word against the Son of man, it will be forgiven him; but he that blasphemes against the holy spirit will not be forgiven it. 11 But when they bring YOU in before public assemblies and government officials and authorities, do not become anxious about how or what YOU will speak in defense or what YOU will say; 12 for the holy spirit will teach YOU in that very hour the things YOU ought to say.”

13 Then a certain one of the crowd said to him: “Teacher, tell my brother to divide the inheritance with me.” 14 He said to him: “Man, who appointed me judge or apportioner over YOU persons?” 15 Then he said to them: “Keep YOUR eyes open and guard against every sort of covetousness, because even when a person has an abundance his life does not result from the things he possesses.” 16 With that he spoke an illustration to them, saying: “The land of a certain rich man produced well. 17 Consequently he began reasoning within himself, saying, ‘What shall I do, now that I have nowhere to gather my crops?’ 18 So he said, ‘I will do this: I will tear down my storehouses and build bigger ones, and there I will gather all my grain and all my good things; 19 and I will say to my soul: “Soul, you have many good things laid up for many years; take your ease, eat, drink, enjoy yourself.”’ 20 But God said to him, ‘Unreasonable one, this night they are demanding your soul from you. Who, then, is to have the things you stored up?’ 21 So it goes with the man that lays up treasure for himself but is not rich toward God.”

22 Then he said to his disciples: “On this account I say to YOU, Quit being anxious about YOUR souls as to what YOU will eat or about YOUR bodies as to what YOU will wear. 23 For the soul is worth more than food and the body than clothing. 24 Mark well that the ravens neither sow seed nor reap, and they have neither barn nor storehouse, and yet God feeds them. Of how much more worth are YOU than birds? 25 Who of YOU by being anxious can add a cubit to his life span? 26 If, therefore, YOU cannot do the least thing, why be anxious about the remaining things? 27 Mark well how the lilies grow; they neither toil nor spin; but I tell YOU, Not even Sol´o·mon in all his glory was arrayed as one of these. 28 If, now, God thus clothes the vegetation in the field that today exists and tomorrow is cast into an oven, how much rather will he clothe YOU, YOU with little faith! 29 So quit seeking what YOU might eat and what YOU might drink, and quit being in anxious suspense; 30 for all these are the things the nations of the world are eagerly pursuing, but YOUR Father knows YOU need these things. 31 Nevertheless, seek continually his kingdom, and these things will be added to YOU.

32 “Have no fear, little flock, because YOUR Father has approved of giving YOU the kingdom. 33 Sell the things belonging to YOU and give gifts of mercy. Make purses for yourselves that do not wear out, a never-failing treasure in the heavens, where a thief does not get near nor moth consumes. 34 For where YOUR treasure is, there YOUR hearts will be also.

35 “Let YOUR loins be girded and YOUR lamps be burning, 36 and YOU yourselves be like men waiting for their master when he returns from the marriage, so that at his arriving and knocking they may at once open to him. 37 Happy are those slaves whom the master on arriving finds watching! Truly I say to YOU, He will gird himself and make them recline at the table and will come alongside and minister to them. 38 And if he arrives in the second watch, even if in the third, and finds them thus, happy are they! 39 But know this, that if the householder had known at what hour the thief would come, he would have kept watching and not have let his house be broken into. 40 YOU also, keep ready, because at an hour that YOU do not think likely the Son of man is coming.”

41 Then Peter said: “Lord, are you saying this illustration to us or also to all?” 42 And the Lord said: “Who really is the faithful steward, the discreet one, whom his master will appoint over his body of attendants to keep giving them their measure of food supplies at the proper time? 43 Happy is that slave, if his master on arriving finds him doing so! 44 I tell YOU truthfully, He will appoint him over all his belongings. 45 But if ever that slave should say in his heart, ‘My master delays coming,’ and should start to beat the menservants and the maidservants, and to eat and drink and get drunk, 46 the master of that slave will come on a day that he is not expecting [him] and in an hour that he does not know, and he will punish him with the greatest severity and assign him a part with the unfaithful ones. 47 Then that slave that understood the will of his master but did not get ready or do in line with his will will be beaten with many strokes. 48 But the one that did not understand and so did things deserving of strokes will be beaten with few. Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be demanded of him; and the one whom people put in charge of much, they will demand more than usual of him.

49 “I came to start a fire on the earth, and what more is there for me to wish if it has already been lighted? 50 Indeed, I have a baptism with which to be baptized, and how I am being distressed until it is finished! 51 Do YOU imagine I came to give peace on the earth? No, indeed, I tell YOU, but rather division. 52 For from now on there will be five in one house divided, three against two and two against three. 53 They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against [her] mother, mother-in-law against [her] daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against [her] mother-in-law.”

54 Then he went on to say also to the crowds: “When YOU see a cloud rising in western parts, at once YOU say, ‘A storm is coming,’ and it turns out so. 55 And when YOU see that a south wind is blowing, YOU say, ‘There will be a heat wave,’ and it occurs. 56 Hypocrites, YOU know how to examine the outward appearance of earth and sky, but how is it YOU do not know how to examine this particular time? 57 Why do YOU not judge also for yourselves what is righteous? 58 For example, when you are going with your adversary at law to a ruler, get to work, while on the way, to rid yourself of the dispute with him, that he may never hale you before the judge, and the judge deliver you to the court officer, and the court officer throw you into prison. 59 I tell you, You will certainly not get out from there until you pay over the last small coin of very little value.”

Deborah
04-04-2008, 08:19 PM
24 “When an unclean spirit comes out of a man, it passes through parched places in search of a resting-place, and, after finding none, it says, ‘I will return to my house out of which I moved.’ 25 And on arriving it finds it swept clean and adorned. 26 Then it goes its way and takes along seven different spirits more wicked than itself, and, after getting inside, they dwell there; and the final circumstances of that man become worse than the first.”


I have heard some JWs say that this refers to yoga. I think it has to do with actual demon possession.

Love, Deborah

billy
04-05-2008, 12:59 AM
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TheCook
04-05-2008, 03:45 AM
24 "When an unclean spirit comes out of a man, it passes through parched places in search of a resting-place, and, after finding none, it says, &#39;I will return to my house out of which I moved.&#39; 25 And on arriving it finds it swept clean and adorned. 26 Then it goes its way and takes along seven different spirits more wicked than itself, and, after getting inside, they dwell there; and the final circumstances of that man become worse than the first."


I have heard some JWs say that this refers to yoga. I think it has to do with actual demon possession.

Love, Deborah[/b]

I always supposed it had to do with zen meditation. I have some experience with that; I actually had a girlfriend once years and years ago whose whole family were very advanced in zen meditation. Her dad had a back problem, and could move his spine into place without going to a chiropractor - just by thought. She even claimed her sister could levitate.

Anyway, what zen meditation is about is empty your mind. Absolutely not think about anything, feel anything, and go into a trance-like state. Like a mind "swept clean and adorned".

Just my thought.

Love, The Cook

Berean
04-05-2008, 01:03 PM
41 Then Peter said: "Lord, are you saying this illustration to us or also to all?" 42 And the Lord said: "Who really is the faithful steward, the discreet one, whom his master will appoint over his body of attendants to keep giving them their measure of food supplies at the proper time? 43 Happy is that slave, if his master on arriving finds him doing so! 44 I tell YOU truthfully, He will appoint him over all his belongings. 45 But if ever that slave should say in his heart, &#39;My master delays coming,&#39; and should start to beat the menservants and the maidservants, and to eat and drink and get drunk, 46 the master of that slave will come on a day that he is not expecting [him] and in an hour that he does not know, and he will punish him with the greatest severity and assign him a part with the unfaithful ones. 47 Then that slave that understood the will of his master but did not get ready or do in line with his will will be beaten with many strokes. 48 But the one that did not understand and so did things deserving of strokes will be beaten with few. Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be demanded of him; and the one whom people put in charge of much, they will demand more than usual of him.[/b]
I&#39;ve always found this part of Luke 12 fascinating. Almost always when talking about the FDS, they give you the same text: Matthew 24:45-47. But Luke 12? Well, sometimes they quote Luke 12:42, but not these surrounding verses. Why not?

"But if ever that slave should say in his heart, &#39;My master delays coming,&#39; and should start to beat the menservants and the maidservants, and to eat and drink and get drunk,"

No other, evil slave. The very same slave that has once been faithful turns evil here. I also think the Governing Body should really take these words of Jesus to heart:

"Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be demanded of him; and the one whom people put in charge of much, they will demand more than usual of him."

They know that people put them in charge of much, they accept that power. As a consequence, they should expect a harsher judgement.


I have heard some JWs say that this refers to yoga. I think it has to do with actual demon possession.[/b]
Yes, so do I. Of course, yoga and zen meditation are bad, but I don&#39;t think it&#39;s because you are making your mind empty, which would somehow invite demons. Demons also enter minds that are quite full. And someone with Alzheimer&#39;s disease could have a quite empty head - automatic invitation for demons? Hmmm...

Of course, the reason why yoga and zen are not fit for Christians, is because they are based in false religion. Religion that takes God out of the equation, instead making a god out of human beings. In the process, one would also &#39;be one with the cosmic plane&#39; or something fishy like that, which of course equates to communicating with the spirit realm.

billy
04-05-2008, 10:56 PM
Matthew 24:45 “Who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time? 46 Happy is that slave if his master on arriving finds him doing so. 47 Truly I say to YOU, He will appoint him over all his belongings.
48 “But if ever that evil slave should say in his heart, ‘My master is delaying,’ 49 and should start to beat his fellow slaves and should eat and drink with the confirmed drunkards, 50 the master of that slave will come on a day that he does not expect and in an hour that he does not know, 51 and will punish him with the greatest severity (Or, “will cut him in two) and will assign him his part with the hypocrites. There is where [his] weeping and the gnashing of [his] teeth will be

Matthew basically says the same as Luke and includes the "evil slave" reference

the footnote for the word "severity" is "will cut him in two - so do you think that means the administration will be cut n 2 - or judged into 2 camps - ie the weeds and the wheat?

doesnt the wto teach the evil slave are the apostates - who criticize the org?

i thougt it was intereting Berean you picked up on the words - "whom people put in charge of much," - so its the people who set themselves up as being in charge and not neccessarily Jehovah

SlaveForJah
04-06-2008, 02:04 AM
doesnt the wto teach the evil slave are the apostates - who criticize the org?[/b]

I believe the official teaching is that the "evil slave" were the various Bible Student segments that no longer wished to be identified with the Judge. This teaching is clearly false and designed to prop up Rutherford&#39;s illegal strong-arm takeover of the Society by claiming that the temple cleansing and inspection had taken place, and that only those who remained in Rutherford&#39;s camp were judged as the "faithful slave". It is something the Watchtower has yet to adress, in terms of coming clean and/or reconciliation. If ever the anointed in the Bible Students were accountable to Jehovah for their calling and their handling of the word of truth, then they are STILL accountable to Him today. Personally, I feel like Bible Students (though I don&#39;t agree with everything they teach) and Jehovah&#39;s Witnesses are in very similar positions to the Two Tribe and Ten Tribe Kingdoms, respectively. But, that&#39;s just me.


i thougt it was intereting Berean you picked up on the words - "whom people put in charge of much," - so its the people who set themselves up as being in charge and not neccessarily Jehovah[/b]

I found that interesting, too, Billy. Thank you, Berean for that gem.


Agape

SlaveForJah