What Does It Mean To Be Taken Captive To Babylon

[Elihu]

Hi everyone,
i am only just starting to consider what the Judgement that will come upon the household of God actually means.
For me personally i find it difficult to understand, But watchman is absolutley correct this is what the prophets point forward to.
can i just take a little time to explain the difficulties i feel about this event and then perhaps people here can help me understand more fully what it all means.

by the way i can sometimes make Homer Simpson look bright so please be patient.

anyway here goes.
As watchman has shown the capture of gods people to babylon in the reign of Nebuchadnezzar is a pattern for the future captivity of gods people when the harlot steers the 8th king to the holy place.

in the first occurance of capture to babaylon the great it seems to have been a physical captivity not a spiritual one. shadrach meshach and abednigo refused to worship the image, daniel was a described as a desireable man by an angel, so even though they were in physical captivity they appeared not to be in spiritual captivity, or where they?

moving to the future captivity how will it be, can it be physical or spiritual, or is it not actually a captivity but more of a domination by the king of the north?

How are they released from captivity, in the first instance Cyrus was sent by Jehovah to free them which he did in a physical way and they were allowed to return to jerusalem.

i can see the outline that watchman has developed from the scriptures, and i can see the resons for their captivity,( the whys ) but the Hows seem vague to me.

i have to tell you i have never been one of Jehovahs witnesess, and therefore do not have the grounding of scriptural education that some obviously have here, so please forgive me if some of my questioning is naive.

elihu

[Jeshurun]

Hello Elihu,

This is a very valid question, and you are not alone in wondering. I have often wondered about this myself. So if I may offer the following:

The exiled Jews in Nebuchadnezzar's Babylon were put under compulsion to worship an image, or face death. We can expect something similar. The examples of how Daniel and his companions remained faithful and trusted in Jehovah, were written so that his people today could reflect on those accounts and hopefully gain enough strength from them to endure similar tests during the last days.

We can also expect severe persecution, for remaining firm in our beliefs in the truths from Jehovah written word. I expect that it may well resemble the Israelites in Egypt. They were witnesses to plague after plague, and yet their captors "refused to repent of their sins". They were in the midst of the plagues, but their faith in Jehovah and their obedience to him delivered them. It will be a difficult time for everyone on earth, so that no one will be alone in their trials.

The prophecies indicate that Jehovah's people will be mocked, persecuted and ridiculed by the religions of Babylon the Great, but Christendom in particular. It is their influence, particularly the Jesuit influence of the Roman Catholic Church, which will cause great distress for Jehovah's people. It is in the source of that persecution that you will probably find the "Mother of the Harlots".

In spite of the dire calamity, Jehovah's faithful sheep will be infused with Holy Spirit that will invigorate them and boost their faith to an all-time high, as I understand it, and all we need to do is stay focused on Jehovah and his coming Kingdom, and he will see us through. But even upon death, as you know, we have the hope of the resurrection very soon afterward. It's impossible to imagine what miracles Jehovah will pull off in order to deliver a great crowd of survivors into his New System, while eliminating every last foe of the genuine Kingdom of Christ. For me, the goal toward which to press, Jehovah willing, is to be an eyewitness to the glorious day of Armageddon.

As Watchman has pointed out in numerous essays and commentaries, the coming collapse of the Watchtower will be a great test of faith to all of Jehovah's Witnesses. Perhaps that is where another aspect of captivity comes in. The idolatrous relationship with the organization will be a stumbling block for many, and the danger would be to follow the exposed "man of lawlessness" down the road to destruction. It will be our task to help as many as possible through this difficult time, helping them to make the right decisions based on the accurate knowledge that we take in here and through our continued study of the Bible..

There is the distinct probability of being hauled off to a prison camp for refusing to renounce pure Christianity, as this seems to be the intention of the coming King of Fierce Countenance. This will put us in the same category as radical terrorists. Once again, this is the time to really lean on Jehovah to pull us through.

These are things that will become clearer as events unfold, and we have yet to see just how the Watchtower is going to be exposed as a false prophet, and just how the "disgusting thing standing in a holy place" will manifest itself.

Hope this helps some!
Love out to all
Lou

[DoubtingThomas]

e-watchman answered a similar Question from Reader on November 7, 2005. His answer can be found here: http://e-watchman.com/mailbag/2005/november-7-2005.html (http://e-watchman.com/mailbag/2005/november-7-2005.html)



Here is part of his answer:



When Nebuchadnezzar sacked Jerusalem and dragged the surviving Jews off to far away Babylon they were most definitely physically captive to the preeminent world power of that era. More than that, the gods of Babylon were made to appear as being more powerful than Jehovah. But Jehovah was ultimately vindicated when he empowered Cyrus to overthrow the city of Babylon--setting the Jews free so they could return and restore Jehovah's worship at Jerusalem. For a certainty, though, there was also a spiritual component to their captivity as well.



Also, it must be pointed out that when the Jews were repurchased from Babylon they exited the city as a congregation. They did not leave individually over decades and generations—as the Watchtower applies it in modern times--as when people resign from some church and become Jehovah's Witnesses.



The captivity of the holy ones to Babylon the Great and the wild beast will surely involve the utter collapse of the Watchtower Society in a way that is presently unforeseeable.



According to Jesus Christ's detailed prophecy of the conclusion of the system of things, we may expect God's holy place to become desolated by the disgusting thing. The desolation of the holy place typifies the destruction of the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses by the 8th king, which at that time will be controlled from behind the scenes by Babylon the Great. In that sense then, Jehovah's holy ones are destined to go into captivity to Babylon the Great.



Take as a pattern the original captivity of the Jews in Babylon: Did the Jews adopt Babylonish false religion while they lived in Babylon? No doubt some did, but Daniel, Ezekiel, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego did not. They remained true to Jehovah even though they were physically captive in Babylon. When their release came, if they were to qualify to restore the formal worship of Jehovah back on Jerusalem's Mound, Jehovah commanded them to leave all babylonish influence behind them and get out of Babylon. It should be noted too, their release came at the hand of Jehovah's anointed king, Cyrus. And they did not individually leave Babylon over a period of decades. Instead they marched as a congregation.



It is in that setting, then, that the future angelic command is heralded: "Get out of her my people!" Our release from captivity to Babylon the Great will come about at the revelation of Christ's glory. Our heeding the command to "get out of her" will require that we identify ourselves as worshippers of Jehovah at a time when doing so may land us in a concentration camp—or worse. Our getting out of her at that time will be an immediate precursor to Jehovah's putting it into the minds of the ruling powers to destroy all religion, worldwide.

Immediately after BTG is destroyed (Rev. 14:8), Jehovah becomes King and the marriage of the Lamb takes place (Rev. 19:1-10). This starts the outbreak of the War of Armageddon (Rev. 19:11-21).

[DoubtingThomas]

What I find confusing is when reading the verses in Revelation 18:1-8 it appears that the call to get out of BTG comes after her fall, and not prior to her being destroyed. Any answers on that?

When is it that the call to get out of Babylon the Great is heard? Is it before her fall or after?

The account tells us, starting chapter 18:

<span style="font-family:Arial">After these things I saw another angel descending from heaven, with great authority; and the earth was lighted up from his glory. [b]² And he cried out with a strong voice, saying: "She has fallen! Babylon the Great has fallen, and she has become a dwelling place of demons and a lurking place of every unclean exhalation and a lurking place of every unclean and hated bird! ³ For because of the wine of the anger of her fornication all the nations have fallen [victim], and the kings of the earth committed fornication with her, and the traveling merchants of the earth became rich due to the power of her shameless luxury."</div>
⁴ And I heard another voice out of heaven say: "Get out of her, my people, if YOU do not want to share with her in her sins, and if YOU do not want to receive part of her plagues. ⁵ For her sins have massed together clear up to heaven, and God has called her acts of injustice to mind. ⁶ Render to her even as she herself rendered, and do to her twice as much, yes, twice the number of the things she did; in the cup in which she put a mixture put twice as much of the mixture for her. ⁷ To the extent that she glorified herself and lived in shameless luxury, to that extent give her torment and mourning. For in her heart she keeps saying, ‘I sit a queen, and I am no widow, and I shall never see mourning.’ ⁸ That is why in one day her plagues will come, death and mourning and famine, and she will be completely burned with fire, because Jehovah God, who judged her, is strong.

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[DoubtingThomas]

Wouldn&#39;t it make sense that if the Jews were not released from captivity to Babylon, until Babylon fell to the Persians, that God&#39;s people will not be released from captivity until Babylon The Great falls?

And doesn&#39;t it make sense that the great final witness work of the two witnesses in Revelation will not begin while they/we are in captivity, but will begin after BTG is destroyed and they/we are released from captivity?

Perhaps 3 1/2 years of captivity and then 3 1/2 years of witnessing?

Seems like I have more questions than answers right now. I could use some help here!

[Elihu]

Thank you Jeshurun and Doubting Thomas,
i really find this subject difficult, as you say it will be a time of testing for everyone, and scripture does say that "everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved"

However if the disgusting thing that causes desolation steered by the harlot enters the holy place, and the man of lawlessness betrays the sheep who are the ones who will heed Christs words to flee.
if i understand the phrase to "flee" corectly it must mean escape.
this is where i find a difference between the original captivity to babylon and the future events.
"when you catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation as spoken of through daniel the prophet, standing standing in a holy place (let the reader use discernment) then let those in judea begin fleeing to the mountains" matt 24:15,16

i have read watchmans reply on his blog to this and how the harlot steers the beast to the holy place and i believe he is correct in that the harlot does still control the beast up to the point when God puts it into the hearts of ten kings to destroy the beast.
However i feel that this warning to flee by Christ is of greater import than we understand at the moment.
putting it as simply as i can why issue a warning if escape is impossible?

applying a scripture from revelation which seems to me to support the idea that a remnant of the annointed may be used as a special instument possibly eventually issuing the call to get out of her my people is rev3 :7

v 10 " because you have kept the word about my endurance i will also keep you from the hour of test which is to come upon the whole inhabited earth to put a test upon those dwelling upon the earth"

is this the same hour of test as the applies to the ten kings for one hour?

i Thank watchman for departing his insight into the scriptures , but i just cannot seem to come to terms with this issue of all the annointed being taken captive.

in a black humor sort of way a person searches for the truth believes he has found the true sons of God only to find that they are first to feel the wrath of God.!, yes i know
"he disciplines those he loves"

thanks for your comments everyone.