12 Tribes

[panda]

Hi all I have a question, I don't understand why some listed in Exodus 1:1-4 are different from those in Rev 1:4-8.

Example. Jacob blessed the young Ephraim ahead of Manasseh. Ex 1:1-4) Mentioned are Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah, Sascha, Zebulin and Benjamin, Dan and Naphtali Gad and Asher. that is 11. No mention of either Manasseh or Ephraim.

In Rev 7:4-8 Mentions. Judah, Reuben Gad and Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon and Levi, Issachar, Zebulun and Joseph, Benjamin.

what happened to Dan, Manasseh is mentioned but not in Exodus, and Ephraim is not mentioned in either.

In Gen 49:1-27) discusses the twelve tribes. Reuben, Simeon and Levi, Judah, Zebulum and Issachar, Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Benjamin, Gad and Joseph.

No mention of Manasseh as in (Rev 7:6) why are these different again. or are they not really related, isn't' this the covenant between Abraham and Isaac as Jacob also is mentioned, in Hebrews 11:9.

panda :icon_redface:

[scrappyd]

Hi all I have a question, I don't understand why some listed in Exodus 1:1-4 are different from those in Rev 1:4-8.

Example. Jacob blessed the young Ephraim ahead of Manasseh. Ex 1:1-4) Mentioned are Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah, Sascha, Zebulin and Benjamin, Dan and Naphtali Gad and Asher. that is 11. No mention of either Manasseh or Ephraim.

In Rev 7:4-8 Mentions. Judah, Reuben Gad and Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon and Levi, Issachar, Zebulun and Joseph, Benjamin.

what happened to Dan, Manasseh is mentioned but not in Exodus, and Ephraim is not mentioned in either.

In Gen 49:1-27) discusses the twelve tribes. Reuben, Simeon and Levi, Judah, Zebulum and Issachar, Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Benjamin, Gad and Joseph.

No mention of Manasseh as in (Rev 7:6) why are these different again. or are they not really related, isn't' this the covenant between Abraham and Isaac as Jacob also is mentioned, in Hebrews 11:9.

panda :icon_redface:[/b]



I do not think they are quite the same, one is listed as the Israel of God. These passages are not really what you asked I do not think, but they do point to a difference. is represented by “the twelve tribes of Israel” that will be judged? They do not represent the 12 tribes of spiritual Israel. (Gal. 6:16; Rev. 7:4-8) The apostles to whom Jesus was speaking were going to be part of spiritual Israel, not judges of its members. Jesus made ‘a covenant with them for a kingdom,’ and they were to be ‘a kingdom and priests to God.’ (Luke 22:28-30; Rev. 5:10) Those of spiritual Israel are to “judge the world.” (1 Cor. 6:2) Hence, “the twelve tribes of Israel,” whom those on the heavenly thrones judge, evidently represent the world of mankind who are outside that royal, priestly class, as pictured by the 12 tribes on Atonement Day.—Lev., chap. 16.

</span></span></span>
Scrappyd

[Rogue]

<div class='quotemain'>Hi all I have a question, I don&#39;t understand why some listed in Exodus 1:1-4 are different from those in Rev 1:4-8.

Example. Jacob blessed the young Ephraim ahead of Manasseh. Ex 1:1-4) Mentioned are Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah, Sascha, Zebulin and Benjamin, Dan and Naphtali Gad and Asher. that is 11. No mention of either Manasseh or Ephraim.

In Rev 7:4-8 Mentions. Judah, Reuben Gad and Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon and Levi, Issachar, Zebulun and Joseph, Benjamin.

what happened to Dan, Manasseh is mentioned but not in Exodus, and Ephraim is not mentioned in either.

In Gen 49:1-27) discusses the twelve tribes. Reuben, Simeon and Levi, Judah, Zebulum and Issachar, Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Benjamin, Gad and Joseph.

No mention of Manasseh as in (Rev 7:6) why are these different again. or are they not really related, isn&#39;t&#39; this the covenant between Abraham and Isaac as Jacob also is mentioned, in Hebrews 11:9.

panda :icon_redface:[/b]



I do not think they are quite the same, one is listed as the Israel of God. These passages are not really what you asked I do not think, but they do point to a difference. is represented by "the twelve tribes of Israel" that will be judged? They do not represent the 12 tribes of spiritual Israel. (Gal. 6:16; Rev. 7:4-8) The apostles to whom Jesus was speaking were going to be part of spiritual Israel, not judges of its members. Jesus made &#39;a covenant with them for a kingdom,&#39; and they were to be &#39;a kingdom and priests to God.&#39; (Luke 22:28-30; Rev. 5:10) Those of spiritual Israel are to "judge the world." (1 Cor. 6:2) Hence, "the twelve tribes of Israel," whom those on the heavenly thrones judge, evidently represent the world of mankind who are outside that royal, priestly class, as pictured by the 12 tribes on Atonement Day.—Lev., chap. 16.

</span></span></span>
Scrappyd
[/b][/quote]

Hmm..
Not too long ago I did some research on the Twelve Tribes, and I came across this excact piece on the CD_ROM, and I just couldn&#39;t believe what I was reading and how everyone just accepts the twists the organisation makes when it suits them... if you research what the symbolic 12 tribes mean, on the CD_ROM, it ALWAYS means the Israel God&#39;s`; the 144000. But in this particulair scripture, where it is said that the ones on the 12 thrones will judge the 12 tribes, ALL OF A SUDDEN the 12 tribes don&#39;t mean the 144000 (because that would, indeed make it a very weird scripture), but ALL OF A SUDDEN the 12 tribes of Israel, normaly a symbol for the chosen ones, now just mean &#39;THE WORLD&#39;. No scriptures to back this up, no logical explanation on why Jehovah would reffer to the godless world as His 12 tribes, there is only the explanation that they HAD to come up with an explanation, because this very scripture undermines their reasoning about the 12 tribes... It is kind of in line with how they always make the negative passages on the Israel Gods apply to false christianity... kind of the same twisting when it suits them...

And to think that the real explanation of this scripture is sooo simple...

[scrappyd]

<div class='quotemain'><div class='quotemain'>Hi all I have a question, I don&#39;t understand why some listed in Exodus 1:1-4 are different from those in Rev 1:4-8.

Example. Jacob blessed the young Ephraim ahead of Manasseh. Ex 1:1-4) Mentioned are Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah, Sascha, Zebulin and Benjamin, Dan and Naphtali Gad and Asher. that is 11. No mention of either Manasseh or Ephraim.

In Rev 7:4-8 Mentions. Judah, Reuben Gad and Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon and Levi, Issachar, Zebulun and Joseph, Benjamin.

what happened to Dan, Manasseh is mentioned but not in Exodus, and Ephraim is not mentioned in either.

In Gen 49:1-27) discusses the twelve tribes. Reuben, Simeon and Levi, Judah, Zebulum and Issachar, Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Benjamin, Gad and Joseph.

No mention of Manasseh as in (Rev 7:6) why are these different again. or are they not really related, isn&#39;t&#39; this the covenant between Abraham and Isaac as Jacob also is mentioned, in Hebrews 11:9.

panda :icon_redface:[/b]



I do not think they are quite the same, one is listed as the Israel of God. These passages are not really what you asked I do not think, but they do point to a difference.With the death of Joshua and of the older men of his generation, the people began to vacillate in their faithfulness and obedience to Jehovah, like a great pendulum swinging to and fro between true and false worship.

</span></span></span>Scrappyd

[Cephalon]

<div class='quotemain'><div class='quotemain'>Hi all I have a question, I don&#39;t understand why some listed in Exodus 1:1-4 are different from those in Rev 1:4-8.

Example. Jacob blessed the young Ephraim ahead of Manasseh. Ex 1:1-4) Mentioned are Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah, Sascha, Zebulin and Benjamin, Dan and Naphtali Gad and Asher. that is 11. No mention of either Manasseh or Ephraim.

In Rev 7:4-8 Mentions. Judah, Reuben Gad and Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon and Levi, Issachar, Zebulun and Joseph, Benjamin.

what happened to Dan, Manasseh is mentioned but not in Exodus, and Ephraim is not mentioned in either.

In Gen 49:1-27) discusses the twelve tribes. Reuben, Simeon and Levi, Judah, Zebulum and Issachar, Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Benjamin, Gad and Joseph.

No mention of Manasseh as in (Rev 7:6) why are these different again. or are they not really related, isn&#39;t&#39; this the covenant between Abraham and Isaac as Jacob also is mentioned, in Hebrews 11:9.

panda :icon_redface:[/b]



I do not think they are quite the same, one is listed as the Israel of God. These passages are not really what you asked I do not think, but they do point to a difference. is represented by "the twelve tribes of Israel" that will be judged? They do not represent the 12 tribes of spiritual Israel. (Gal. 6:16; Rev. 7:4-8) The apostles to whom Jesus was speaking were going to be part of spiritual Israel, not judges of its members. Jesus made &#39;a covenant with them for a kingdom,&#39; and they were to be &#39;a kingdom and priests to God.&#39; (Luke 22:28-30; Rev. 5:10) Those of spiritual Israel are to "judge the world." (1 Cor. 6:2) Hence, "the twelve tribes of Israel," whom those on the heavenly thrones judge, evidently represent the world of mankind who are outside that royal, priestly class, as pictured by the 12 tribes on Atonement Day.—Lev., chap. 16.

</span></span></span>
Scrappyd
[/b][/quote]

Hmm..
Not too long ago I did some research on the Twelve Tribes, and I came across this excact piece on the CD_ROM, and I just couldn&#39;t believe what I was reading and how everyone just accepts the twists the organisation makes when it suits them... if you research what the symbolic 12 tribes mean, on the CD_ROM, it ALWAYS means the Israel God&#39;s`; the 144000. But in this particulair scripture, where it is said that the ones on the 12 thrones will judge the 12 tribes, ALL OF A SUDDEN the 12 tribes don&#39;t mean the 144000 (because that would, indeed make it a very weird scripture), but ALL OF A SUDDEN the 12 tribes of Israel, normaly a symbol for the chosen ones, now just mean &#39;THE WORLD&#39;. No scriptures to back this up, no logical explanation on why Jehovah would reffer to the godless world as His 12 tribes, there is only the explanation that they HAD to come up with an explanation, because this very scripture undermines their reasoning about the 12 tribes... It is kind of in line with how they always make the negative passages on the Israel Gods apply to false christianity... kind of the same twisting when it suits them...

And to think that the real explanation of this scripture is sooo simple...
[/b][/quote]

And what is the &#39;real explanation&#39; of this scripture?

[Rogue]

<div class='quotemain'><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotemain'>Hi all I have a question, I don&#39;t understand why some listed in Exodus 1:1-4 are different from those in Rev 1:4-8.

Example. Jacob blessed the young Ephraim ahead of Manasseh. Ex 1:1-4) Mentioned are Reuben, Simeon, Levi, and Judah, Sascha, Zebulin and Benjamin, Dan and Naphtali Gad and Asher. that is 11. No mention of either Manasseh or Ephraim.

In Rev 7:4-8 Mentions. Judah, Reuben Gad and Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Simeon and Levi, Issachar, Zebulun and Joseph, Benjamin.

what happened to Dan, Manasseh is mentioned but not in Exodus, and Ephraim is not mentioned in either.

In Gen 49:1-27) discusses the twelve tribes. Reuben, Simeon and Levi, Judah, Zebulum and Issachar, Dan, Asher, Naphtali, Benjamin, Gad and Joseph.

No mention of Manasseh as in (Rev 7:6) why are these different again. or are they not really related, isn&#39;t&#39; this the covenant between Abraham and Isaac as Jacob also is mentioned, in Hebrews 11:9.

panda :icon_redface:[/b]



I do not think they are quite the same, one is listed as the Israel of God. These passages are not really what you asked I do not think, but they do point to a difference. is represented by "the twelve tribes of Israel" that will be judged? They do not represent the 12 tribes of spiritual Israel. (Gal. 6:16; Rev. 7:4-8) The apostles to whom Jesus was speaking were going to be part of spiritual Israel, not judges of its members. Jesus made &#39;a covenant with them for a kingdom,&#39; and they were to be &#39;a kingdom and priests to God.&#39; (Luke 22:28-30; Rev. 5:10) Those of spiritual Israel are to "judge the world." (1 Cor. 6:2) Hence, "the twelve tribes of Israel," whom those on the heavenly thrones judge, evidently represent the world of mankind who are outside that royal, priestly class, as pictured by the 12 tribes on Atonement Day.—Lev., chap. 16.

</span></span></span>
Scrappyd
[/b][/quote]

Hmm..
Not too long ago I did some research on the Twelve Tribes, and I came across this excact piece on the CD_ROM, and I just couldn&#39;t believe what I was reading and how everyone just accepts the twists the organisation makes when it suits them... if you research what the symbolic 12 tribes mean, on the CD_ROM, it ALWAYS means the Israel God&#39;s`; the 144000. But in this particulair scripture, where it is said that the ones on the 12 thrones will judge the 12 tribes, ALL OF A SUDDEN the 12 tribes don&#39;t mean the 144000 (because that would, indeed make it a very weird scripture), but ALL OF A SUDDEN the 12 tribes of Israel, normaly a symbol for the chosen ones, now just mean &#39;THE WORLD&#39;. No scriptures to back this up, no logical explanation on why Jehovah would reffer to the godless world as His 12 tribes, there is only the explanation that they HAD to come up with an explanation, because this very scripture undermines their reasoning about the 12 tribes... It is kind of in line with how they always make the negative passages on the Israel Gods apply to false christianity... kind of the same twisting when it suits them...

And to think that the real explanation of this scripture is sooo simple...
[/b][/quote]

And what is the &#39;real explanation&#39; of this scripture?
[/b][/quote]

I&#39;m not allowed to share my view on this, since it violates forum regulations, but if u want to know my opinion, u can pm me :)