In What Way(s) Is The Evil Slave Beating His Fellow Slaves?

[Juan23]

Mat 24:48-51 "But if ever that evil slave should say in his heart, 'My master is delaying,'
and should start to beat his fellow slaves and should eat and drink with the confirmed drunkards, the master of that slave will come on a day that he does not expect and in an hour that he does not know, and will punish him with the greatest severity and will assign him his part with the hypocrites. There is where [his] weeping and the gnashing of [his] teeth will be.

In what way(s) is the evil slave(s) beating his fellow slaves?

I'll start with one. Asking all to increase their hours in preaching(?) (knocking on empty houses or talking to not interested people).

[barry]

Hi,

I would also think about the way they are treating other anointed persons. Robert has been disfellowshipped for apostasy, just because he is applying prophecy in another way as the GB and he is speaking about it.
I would consider this also as beating fellow slaves.

regards,
Barry

[Jinnvisible]

In what way(s) is the evil slave(s) beating his fellow slaves?

I'll start with one. Asking all to increase their hours in preaching(?) (knocking on empty houses or talking to not interested people).[/b]

I equate the delaying of the master text with Moses on the mountain during the Exodus.

They made an idol due to the delay. I don`t believe that reveling is singing and dancing per se. It is specifically to my mind celebrating with immoral disregard. So if the Israelites had been celebrating thier escape from egypt giving true glory to Jehovah without making a metal cow, and singing and dancing ~ without immoral relations ect. I don`t think that would have been a problem.

David danced and sand before the ark, yet I even been told by elders that he was wrong to do that because Uzah died. I don`t believe that at all because the reason he was struck is specifically given in scripture. The dancing David may have stopped because of what happened but it doesn`t really follow that David was a wrong doer or that his singing and dancing was related to the striking of Uzah just because he stopped once uzah was killed.

Due to my perspective I think that the beating of the fellow slaves has to do with maintaining dominance, which is obvious through the illustration.

Any reasoning that does not specifically support an official position come through organisational hierachy is either lightly disregarded or considered egoism even if it doesn`t detract from any point the WT institution has made. That is a definate beating down.

The commission to preach is given, and the intent to encourage that also.

However the drive to glorify the organisation by printing hours of preaching and territory and such is for me a kind of revelling for the idol, it is to bring glory to the institution rather than to God. It doesn`t really matter that thiere is no song and dance. The song and dance is 1914 doctrine or an ontellectual reveling in self righteous - self approval. However unfortunately this is virtually indistinguishable from a genuine adherance to the bibles commands to preach. Hence it also fulfills the wheat and the weeds scenario in an intelectual capacity, because the preaching to glorify the idol, is all wrapped up in the preaching of the good news.

So yes I believe you are correct, yet it doesn`t remove the given impetus to preach the truth. So you`ve got to find a way however pathetic. Talking to the guy at the bus stop ect.

If I`m wrong i`m dead because I like to sing and dance before God.

[shikinah]

The wicked slave beat down emotionally those who have been sexually abused, but ignoring the seriousness of their plight. They beat their flock mentally with fear of thinking for ones self and seeing the scriptures from your own perspective. They beat their flock severely with their twisted words and deceit, stumbling those who put their entire heart and faith in these men, to find out these very ones rode the back of the beast condoning the verything that they once called a hated wild beast.
They beat their anointed and break down their spirit by mocking their god given wisdom, yes what they have done to others, the master has instore for them.

Elizabeth

[Juan23]

The commission to preach is given, and the intent to encourage that also.

However the drive to glorify the organisation by printing hours of preaching and territory and such is for me a kind of revelling for the idol, it is to bring glory to the institution rather than to God. It doesn`t really matter that thiere is no song and dance. The song and dance is 1914 doctrine or an ontellectual reveling in self righteous - self approval. However unfortunately this is virtually indistinguishable from a genuine adherance to the bibles commands to preach. Hence it also fulfills the wheat and the weeds scenario in an intelectual capacity, because the preaching to glorify the idol, is all wrapped up in the preaching of the good news.

So yes I believe you are correct, yet it doesn`t remove the given impetus to preach the truth. So you`ve got to find a way however pathetic. Talking to the guy at the bus stop ect.[/b]

The commission to preach is scriptural, the counting of the hours is not. There is nothing more pleasing than when while you are talking to somebody, the topics suddenly is about the bible, Jehovah, Jesus or prophesy. This is more so if the other party seem to have initiated these topics.

Talking to somebody at the door who is obviously intent on driving you away is probably ineffective. Then again maybe it might be true that "bad" publicity is better than no publicity.

[Desert Blossom]

I would say one way that they beat their fellow slave is by withholding truth, when it is in their power to be truthful. By deceiving the flock they are abusing them in a spiritual way.

[TheMdC]

What examples are you thinking of here, Desert Blossom?

[Utuna]

"Le sectarisme des jugements pauvres lui tenait quelquefois lieu de volonté" - Hervé Bazin
"J'ai pétri de la boue et j'en ai fait de l'or" - Charles Baudelaire
"S&#39;il m&#39;a été donné de voir un peu plus loin que les autres, c&#39;est que je me tenais sur les épaules de géants" - Isaac Newton</span>

[TheMdC]

Your post, Utuna, just got me thinking about the word "delay," and the context of the scripture.

The master isn&#39;t late. It isn&#39;t past time for his arrival. The delay is a misconception based on the wrong reasonings in the heart of the evil slave.
(Matthew 24:48-50)

As this thread shows, the beating of fellow slaves is an interesting part of this passage.

So is the eating and drinking with the confirmed drunkards. Anyone want to take a stab at what that means? Or should we confine this thread to the beating of slaves and start another thread on this portion of the passage?

[Utuna]

"Le sectarisme des jugements pauvres lui tenait quelquefois lieu de volonté" - Hervé Bazin
"J&#39;ai pétri de la boue et j&#39;en ai fait de l&#39;or" - Charles Baudelaire
"S&#39;il m&#39;a été donné de voir un peu plus loin que les autres, c&#39;est que je me tenais sur les épaules de géants" - Isaac Newton</span>

[panda]

the evil slave just want to keep ruling, and don&#39;t want to recognize any other anointed outside its clique and especially if they have a different scriptural view even if it is right.
Like Saul and Solomon, the superfine apostles they have become legends in their own minds, pride and the power, the corrupting influence. I guess they have to beat their slaves to keep them in submission, otherwise their phony unity at all costs will crumble, like a house of cards.

1Cor 4:8

[FutureMan]

Your post, Utuna, just got me thinking about the word "delay," and the context of the scripture.

The master isn&#39;t late. It isn&#39;t past time for his arrival. The delay is a misconception based on the wrong reasonings in the heart of the evil slave.
(Matthew 24:48-50)

As this thread shows, the beating of fellow slaves is an interesting part of this passage.

So is the eating and drinking with the confirmed drunkards. Anyone want to take a stab at what that means? Or should we confine this thread to the beating of slaves and start another thread on this portion of the passage?[/b]

If we look at the time Moses went up to the mountain of God and received instructions and the Ten Commandments, we do see a parallel today,

When Moses went away and up into the mountain, the people thought that he was delayed, in fact they did not know whether he was coming back, so they persuaded Aaron to make this golden calf (idol) so that they could make a start of worshiping God.

Of course this was influenced by their stay in Egypt and of course the many Egyptians that came out of the land of Egypt with them.

Today the organization is waiting for the Greater Moses (Jesus) to come back and it appears to it&#39;s members, that Jesus return is delayed, so the organization (the Golden Calf) has become the instrument (Idol) at this time for worshiping God.

In fact they are no longer worshiping God through Jesus, but are worshiping him through the organization.
Yes the organization has become their mediator, instead of Christ.

To this effect the governing body have become lazy as the lazy slave in the parable and they have become like drunk people who do not have there full senses.
Yes they have become drunk shepherds who are going asleep because of being drunk with their own importance in the scheme of things, they are not really awake to the real events just ahead.

On top of that they are beating their fellow slaves, those who are the rest of the anointed ones and the those who are said to be of the Great Crowd who are also involved in the preaching of the Good News.

Rather than use their resources to spread the Good News themselves Via such avenues such as the Radio, Television and now the Internet they are relying on the other anointed ones and the Great Crowd to do this preaching work by the door to door method and to this end they continue to brow beat their members through the meetings and their literature such as the Watchtower and regular conventions.

This is how the beating is done in a figurative sense.

Whether you agree with me or not, this is how I see it.

From FutureMan.

[dgibson]

I think beatings happen at assemblies, with planned upbuilding ones experiences being given via platform.

Yes, many are able to pioneer, meet and have many bible studies. They bring many into the truth, but this parading of these ones on stage, and asking all to look for ways to make pioneer status is a beating. They point out how Jehovah removes obsticles in their lives to become pioneers, or missonaries.

Then the comments of what the society is doing, by some of the ones giving talks from bethel, like they are so smart with how they are doing things, and Jehovah is blessing their efforts every step of the way. It makes you so inspired to worship that calf more, because they are doing such wonderful things.

Well, so does christendom have many missionaries, and they have the same experiences to relate of things being moved and cleared out of their way to do seemingly wonderful things.

I think the eating with the drunkards, is like that meeting of the nations that some of the bethelites attend to help steer freedom of religion, and keep peace between them. It was mentioned on another thread about their attendance to a sumit, or something. Maybe someone who remembers can help my memory on which meeting that was.

[TheMdC]

I think about that TV show about the family with 18 kids. Solid Christian family and a good example to everyone who watches it. It&#39;s not preachy; I don&#39;t even think they say what religion they are (I&#39;m guessing some kind of independent baptist but it&#39;s just a guess). Would the org support a brother doing such a TV show? Or would he be "talked to" in the back room and maybe lose his privileges?

[elihu]

i find the idea of the notion of the good and evil slave existing at this present time rather confusing.

to apply it to the present wto situation seems a little skewed to me, because the good slave must be under control of the evil one
how do we dicipher between the two slaves?
because if we go with the idea that the evil slave is the source of the 1914 falsity why does the good slave comply with that ?

not sure what i have asked will make much sense, but i know what i mean.

would that scripture of the good and evil slave not fit a near future event

the 1914 teaching is collapsing around the WTO
this is going to be a major test of faith to manyJWs
will their faith also collapse along with the 1914 teaching?
will they turn back to the world and false teaching?
what will they do if it does, will they turn upon those who still believe?

will they beat their once fellow slaves?

elihu

[TheMdC]

I think I understand you, elihu.

The organization isn&#39;t going to do anything about its 1914 teaching. Too much depends on it. Besides, they&#39;ve already made the adaptation that is pretty much timeless by defining the "generation" as the anointed remnant on earth. As long as there are partakers at the Memorial (and these are INcreasing over the last 30 years, so they&#39;re sitting comfortably at present) they can say their definition of the "generation" is correct.

As for the faithful and evil slaves, they aren&#39;t judged as such until Christ comes to judge his house. Personally, I don&#39;t think this is a specific prophecy with a single fulfillment. There are faithful and evil slaves all over the place. They certainly aren&#39;t corporations.

[Desert Blossom]

What examples are you thinking of here, Desert Blossom?[/b]

One example would be how they know 1914 and all the doctrines built on it have no foundation. They have selfish reasons for not admitting that.

[TheMdC]

I wonder how many know that as compared to how many are just true believers.

[dgibson]

The weeds and the wheat are growing together. The weeds keep the 1914 business as usual going, but secretly the wheat knows that it is a possible non-truth and they are waiting on Jehovah to have the weeds uprooted. They, the "wheat" maintain this position for the sake of the sheep, and those that want to still come to know Jehovah.

[Utuna]

"Le sectarisme des jugements pauvres lui tenait quelquefois lieu de volonté" - Hervé Bazin
"J&#39;ai pétri de la boue et j&#39;en ai fait de l&#39;or" - Charles Baudelaire
"S&#39;il m&#39;a été donné de voir un peu plus loin que les autres, c&#39;est que je me tenais sur les épaules de géants" - Isaac Newton</span>

[FutureMan]

<div class='quotemain'>Hello Utuna, at least I&#39;m good for something. :)

From FutureMan

[Desert Blossom]

I wonder how many know that as compared to how many are just true believers.[/b]

The Governing Body has been challenged by numerous brothers for many decades. The earliest reference I have seen was in the early 30&#39;s, perhaps 1932, by a brother who was a member of Bethel. I wish I could remember his name, and if I ever come across the reference again I will be sure to post it. The brother wrote a letter to Rutherford, challenging the 1914 doctrine. I don&#39;t recall if the brother ended up disassociating himself or disfellowshipped, but it was one or the other.

FutureMan posted a link to a site where a brother&#39;s inquiries from as early as 1963 were challenging the 1914 doctrine. See the thread Mythical 1914 (http://users.bigpond.net.au/mhattonSDA/JEHOVAH%27S%20WITNESSES%20AND%201914.htm). I&#39;ve come across dozens more similar testimonies on the internet. The Governing Body is well aware of the issues. Instead of directly answering the challenges, the Society sends back replies that are all smoke and mirrors, as was documented on The Mythical site.

Robert King even filed a formal charge of apostasy, demanding that there be a judicial inquiry. I can&#39;t access the e-watchman site right now because my computer wants an updated version of Adobe flash player, which means shutting down my browser, which means losing this post, which means you can search for it on your own. ;)

Jesus is calling us all to repentance, we have it all spelled out clearly for us in the 2nd and 3rd chapters of Revelation. Some are responding, some are not. At this point in time the GB is not responding, but when the time comes for Jehovah&#39;s judgment to be executed they will not have any excuses to fall back on.

(Hebrews 12:11) 11 True, no discipline seems for the present to be joyous, but grievous; yet afterward to those who have been trained by it it yields peaceable fruit, namely, righteousness.

It hasn&#39;t been easy to admit that I was deceived into believing a lie, and that not only did I believe it, but I passed it on to others. I feel a deep sense of shame over that. I wish the GB did too.

[Desert Blossom]

Open Letters (http://www.e-watchman.com/watchman-commentaries-collection.html)

That&#39;s the link I couldn&#39;t access earlier.

[Desert Blossom]

http://e-watchman.com/watchtower-jehovahs-...-ngo-truth.html (http://e-watchman.com/watchtower-jehovahs-witnesses-un-ngo-truth.html)

Here&#39;s another good link to source material.

[shikinah]

Thank you Desert Blossom for those two links, its unbelievable how many times the awake make references to the UN. I doubt there&#39;s any other religion which mentions the UN in their literature as much as the WTS.

Elizabeth

[noname]

Just by keeping friends in the dark about the UN and 1914 issues is a form of beating. A mental beating of sorts. If you have the truth there is nothing to hide. No question should be excusable. Every question should be taken on with spiritual soberness not with critisism and counseling.
I noticed that when an old sliding door comes off the track, sometimes you have to forcefully jam it back in place. I would illustrate this on how those who ask questions are viewed as off the "track" and the shepeards have to jam you back on or "beat" YOU.

The truth is smooth flowing lifegiving WATER, it is sober and resoning. The drunkards want to stay drunk, they cant let a watchmans resoning sober them up, then they would have to face the consequences. So come on everyone lets just spiritually party, and throw these issues out the window! Lets jump on the river of wine. Lets comment at the meetings about the society and say things like "the society says...." and feel proud about our great religion and its building projects, and vast wealth.

On second thought, let Jehovah pour his life giving water like the floods of Noah onto our Brothers and Sisters and make us all sober, free us from these bonds!

[Desert Blossom]

Just by keeping friends in the dark about the UN and 1914 issues is a form of beating. A mental beating of sorts. If you have the truth there is nothing to hide. No question should be excusable. Every question should be taken on with spiritual soberness not with critisism and counseling.
I noticed that when an old sliding door comes off the track, sometimes you have to forcefully jam it back in place. I would illustrate this on how those who ask questions are viewed as off the "track" and the shepeards have to jam you back on or "beat" YOU.

The truth is smooth flowing lifegiving WATER, it is sober and resoning. The drunkards want to stay drunk, they cant let a watchmans resoning sober them up, then they would have to face the consequences. So come on everyone lets just spiritually party, and throw these issues out the window! Lets jump on the river of wine. Lets comment at the meetings about the society and say things like "the society says...." and feel proud about our great religion and its building projects, and vast wealth.

On second thought, let Jehovah pour his life giving water like the floods of Noah onto our Brothers and Sisters and make us all sober, free us from these bonds!


Amen brother!

(1 Peter 3:13-15) . . .Indeed, who is the man that will harm YOU if YOU become zealous for what is good? 14 But even if YOU should suffer for the sake of righteousness, YOU are happy. However, the object of their fear do not YOU fear, neither become agitated. 15 But sanctify the Christ as Lord in YOUR hearts, always ready to make a defense before everyone that demands of YOU a reason for the hope in YOU, but doing so together with a mild temper and deep respect.