Jehovah God an exact time-keeper

[FutureMan]

Hello all, do not know if you remember but I made a post a while ago, suggesting that the calculation of the seven times according to the Julian calendar, appeared to me to be incompatible with the Julian calendar dates.

This is because the 7 times was based solely on multiples of 360 days by 7, of which equals to 2520 days, but when using the day for a year rule, this is
converted to 2520 years.

Now the Society is saying that we are going by the lunar year of 360 days in this calculation or at least they did until awhile ago, when they started using the 1260 days (3 half times) multiplied by two rule, to come to an answer of 2520 years.

They stopped using the 360 by 7 rule and replaced it with the 1260 days times 2 rule. (note 1260 days equals to 3 and a half times)

Now I have a problem with this because I believe Jehovah God to be an EXACT TIMEKEEPER.

So if we were to take the Julian calendar into this time equation, I worked out that the Society are at least 28 years out, in relation to the true time period that now exist as 1914 AD or CE.

This is because the Julian year is 365 days, over 5 days more than the lunar year.
Therein lies the problem.

I have included here a chart so that you can see what I'm getting at.
See what you think, in any case as whether there is a case of gross
miscalculation.

This chart is based on an approximate calculation and not even taking into
account the leap years that you would need to add on as well every four years.

See what you all think in any case.

I hope this diagram is big enough for you to view.

[mrgalleria]

Alo ha,
Nice effort. I agree with you that God is THE timekeeper.
Pray for Holy Spirit to direct your search.
Maybe you will be given an opportunity to listen.
Bill

[uglyandthin]

Hello all, do not know if you remember but I made a post a while ago, suggesting that the calculation of the seven times according to the Julian calendar, appeared to me to be incompatible with the Julian calendar dates.

This is because the 7 times was based solely on multiples of 360 days by 7, of which equals to 2520 days, but when using the day for a year rule, this is
converted to 2520 years.

Now the Society is saying that we are going by the lunar year of 360 days in this calculation or at least they did until awhile ago, when they started using the 1260 days (3 half times) multiplied by two rule, to come to an answer of 2520 years.

They stopped using the 360 by 7 rule and replaced it with the 1260 days times 2 rule. (note 1260 days equals to 3 and a half times)

Now I have a problem with this because I believe Jehovah God to be an EXACT TIMEKEEPER.

So if we were to take the Julian calendar into this time equation, I worked out that the Society are at least 28 years out, in relation to the true time period that now exist as 1914 AD or CE.

This is because the Julian year is 365 days, over 5 days more than the lunar year.
Therein lies the problem.

I have included here a chart so that you can see what I'm getting at.
See what you think, in any case as whether there is a case of gross
miscalculation.

This chart is based on an approximate calculation and not even taking into
account the leap years that you would need to add on as well every four years.

See what you all think in any case.

I hope this diagram is big enough for you to view.



Hi Futureman:

You are aware of the fact that there was an extra month inserted into the Jewish calendar every so many years to even out this disparity. If you were using an "idealized" lunar calendar with 30 days each month as you allude to in your comment, it would take just one extra month per every 6 years to even things out pretty well. I am not an expert on this, but just wanted to point that out. Sorry if you already knew this.

Perhaps a better question is if Jehovah is such a mathematician (and I believe he is the ultimate mathematician) why did he have the earth revolving around the sun in 365.something days each year and for that matter the moon orbiting the earth every 28 or 29. something days. Why not place them both in an orbit of 360 days, and 30 days respectively. I am sure there is a good reason for it, how about anyone else?

uglyandthin

[Jahsdisciple]

Jehovah is a time keeper,but who says the "gentile times" IS an equation for us to say it equals 2520 years ? It mentions the 7 times,but whats the real application ?

The gentile times are SUPPOSED to be about when Jesus will start being King when the kingdom has begun.

He said, "at a time you dont think,the son of man is comming"..this could be talking about the final war(which couldnt be right,because once the GT has started,its 42 months to the Big A),but the GT is a sign that the Kingdom has been born. SO,this would mean that the kingdom being established should equal the end of the "gentile times".

If this is the case,then the equation must be wrong..or the way its being worked out is wrong...or we are presuming its an equation,which it might NOT BE.

It seems contradictory that Jesus would say the above,yet there is an equation to show when the Kingdom would be established. I havnt got an answer,but this is what comes to mind.

[FutureMan]

Hi Futureman:

You are aware of the fact that there was an extra month inserted into the Jewish calendar every so many years to even out this disparity. If you were using an "idealized" lunar calendar with 30 days each month as you allude to in your comment, it would take just one extra month per every 6 years to even things out pretty well. I am not an expert on this, but just wanted to point that out. Sorry if you already knew this.

Perhaps a better question is if Jehovah is such a mathematician (and I believe he is the ultimate mathematician) why did he have the earth revolving around the sun in 365.something days each year and for that matter the moon orbiting the earth every 28 or 29. something days. Why not place them both in an orbit of 360 days, and 30 days respectively. I am sure there is a good reason for it, how about anyone else?

uglyandthin

Actually I did know that the lunar year is actually 354 days in length and every so often an extra month is added to make up to 360 days as I understand, but not for a solar year of 365 days as is under the Roman calendar.

It does not really matter in any case, because the Watchtower Society has only used the 360 days by 7 times to arrive at 2520 years, at least that is what they have told the rest of the organization in their past literature anyhow.

Or do they tell the public including us one thing, but they mean something else?

Oh by the way I think I made a mistake in the extra days (10,220) in my chart calculation, I think it should be 10,200.

But this chart is not meant to be an accurate translation only to show how there could be a disparity between the two calendars and how the Watchtower Society has only used 360 days in their day for a year calculations to arrive at 2520 days, so as to arrive at 1914, as the end of the Gentiles.

[FutureMan]

Jehovah is a time keeper,but who says the "gentile times" IS an equation for us to say it equals 2520 years ? It mentions the 7 times,but whats the real application ?

The gentile times are SUPPOSED to be about when Jesus will start being King when the kingdom has begun.

He said, "at a time you dont think,the son of man is comming"..this could be talking about the final war(which couldnt be right,because once the GT has started,its 42 months to the Big A),but the GT is a sign that the Kingdom has been born. SO,this would mean that the kingdom being established should equal the end of the "gentile times".

If this is the case,then the equation must be wrong..or the way its being worked out is wrong...or we are presuming its an equation,which it might NOT BE.

It seems contradictory that Jesus would say the above,yet there is an equation to show when the Kingdom would be established. I havnt got an answer,but this is what comes to mind.

Hello Jahsdisciple, whatever the application of the seven times really is, is not what I have concerned myself here with, but to show that actual calculation could be wrong as to the application of the seven times as to the Watchtower Society.

[Gilligan]

Actually I did know that the lunar year is actually 354 days in length and every so often an extra month is added to make up to 360 days as I understand, but not for a solar year of 365 days as is under the Roman calendar.

It does not really matter in any case, because the Watchtower Society has only used the 360 days by 7 times to arrive at 2520 years, at least that is what they have told the rest of the organization in their past literature anyhow.

Or do they tell the public including us one thing, but they mean something else?

Oh by the way I think I made a mistake in the extra days (10,220) in my chart calculation, I think it should be 10,200.

But this chart is not meant to be an accurate translation only to show how there could be a disparity between the two calendars and how the Watchtower Society has only used 360 days in their day for a year calculations to arrive at 2520 days, so as to arrive at 1914, as the end of the Gentiles.
Alright FM, good research here I guess.

Billy sez, "Nice effort. I agree with you that God is THE timekeeper.
Pray for Holy Spirit to direct your search.
Maybe you will be given an opportunity to listen."
Which he probably means you're wasting your time trying to put an exact time period of His coming.


JD sez, "Jehovah is a time keeper,but who says the "gentile times" IS an equation for us to say it equals 2520 years ? It mentions the 7 times,but whats the real application ?
The gentile times are SUPPOSED to be about when Jesus will start being King when the kingdom has begun.
He said, "at a time you dont think,the son of man is comming"..this could be talking about the final war(which couldnt be right,because once the GT has started,its 42 months to the Big A),but the GT is a sign that the Kingdom has been born. SO,this would mean that the kingdom being established should equal the end of the "gentile times".
If this is the case,then the equation must be wrong..or the way its being worked out is wrong...or we are presuming its an equation,which it might NOT BE.
It seems contradictory that Jesus would say the above,yet there is an equation to show when the Kingdom would be established. I havnt got an answer,but this is what comes to mind."


Ultimately to this conversation, I would like to know, what is the ultimate POINT to all this?
Are we trying to get another set date in mind?? Trying to guess a year, maybe a month closer?

[FutureMan]

Alright FM, good research here I guess.


Which he probably means you're wasting your time trying to put an exact time period of His coming.

Ultimately to this conversation, I would like to know, what is the ultimate POINT to all this?
Are we trying to get another set date in mind?? Trying to guess a year, maybe a month closer?

Hello Gilligan, you mistake what I'm trying to do here, not to predict anything, as if I can, but to show how it could have being miscalculated from the Watchtower's perspective.

Jesus said the nobody knows the day or the hour, to his apostles back then, and I believe that the same goes for today.

This was just a simple exercise to show how the date of 1914 could be wrong, even if the Kingdom was to be set up around that time.
Which I do not believe has occurred as yet, at least not in it's full form, with all it's members.

I believe that in reality that the Kingdom has being in existence since Pentecost 33 CE, with Jesus being given all authority in heaven and earth and the benefits of that Kingdom was being manifested by means of the Holy spirit that was poured out on his disciples back then.

But this Kingdom has not yet benefited the world as a whole, only the Christian congregation, in a spiritual sense.

The rest of it's member's will be resurrected to heavenly life as members of that Kingdom after the seventh and final trumpet is blown.

First will be the ones who had died faithful up and until then, and then those who are still alive on the earth will join them soon after to make up the complete number of (144,000) whether that be a literal number or a symbolic number.

[Jahsdisciple]

FutureMan,
I know you are trying to see if the WTs calculations are wrong etc,but i was thinking that just because you can find from other verses what 3.5 times is and then multiply times 2 to get 7 times somwhere else may not mean anything. who says they are connected at all. Its seems rather co-incidental but there is no guarentee its right to take all verses using the phrase "times" and apply it to the end.

"SEVEN" in the bible refers to heavenly completeness,so the passing of 7 times may just mean that a period of time may pass that is appropriate for all things heavenly to be bought to a perfect "completeness"

In peoples keeness to see the end come,perhaps they connected "dots" that wernt really there. Then on the other hand,there is something compelling about this whole equation..."the bibles inner harmony" etc.

If the equation is right in some way,even if the starting point is wrong,where does it start...and what date does it then gives us ?

Heavenly "Times" might be something totally differant. Time and counting of time is totally differant up there. JD.