I Was....

[Gabriel]

.....Thinking after watching a movie about Nazi Germany, How cruel their torture methods were and how they were able to get people to do things that they ordinarily wouldnt do. The police literally went from house to house rounding up families like cattle...those who would not conform to their idiology.Then I started thinking about the G.T and how many of us might have to endure simular situations.

Satan has had more than enough time to findout which torture methods work the best. to get us to say or do whatever....such as denying the exiestance of God. Although we wouldnt do such a thing on our own accord we would basicly be bullied to do so in this case.

My question is if you are being tortured unimaginably in an attempt to get you to say or deny the existance of God. isnt that not rape in the spiritual sence? And if so why would a Christian be held acountable for that???

[Sketch]

My question is if you are being tortured unimaginably in an attempt to get you to say or deny the existance of God. isnt that not rape in the spiritual sence? And if so why would a Christian be held acountable for that???[/b]

well, What I've seen in my life is that people are more AFRAID of the THREAT of pain (torture) than of the pain itself (ever wince at a needle stick only to discover its already done and over?). That said, if someone IS being tortured, they are more than likely going to be in shock of some form or other (i.e. hypovolemic, neurologic, anaphylactic, cardiogenic, etc. depending on the type of torture being used) and their mind will not work properly. But i have to believe at that point, the people are not looking for any real "confession" - they're just being sick.

So, with the mind not working properly, I don't see how someone could be held accountable... but of course, that is up to Jehovah to know if you still have your wits about you...

[Jinnvisible]

My question is if you are being tortured unimaginably in an attempt to get you to say or deny the existance of God. isnt that not rape in the spiritual sence? And if so why would a Christian be held acountable for that???[/b]

<div align="left">[/b]Romans 7:15-17 but what I hate is what I do. However, if what I do not wish is what I do, I agree that the Law is fine. But now the one working it out is no longer I, but sin that resides in me</div>
</span>Christ called out `why have you forsaken me?` he knew the issues - intellectually.

In my estimation its the very same question as `how do I make my faith perfect?`. A very consciencious question and one that a person might benefit from re asking themselves, if it leads them to talk to God, and send thier thoughts to God.</span>

[stayawake]

The fear of Man is a strong weapon of satans.
Look at Peter, he assured Jesus he would never deney him, but he did, but afterward he was crushed to tears that he had weakened. He was forgiven, was he not. ?

So many are recorded as doing the same yet afterwards were crushed to the heart, and forgiven.
Please don&#39;t worry about the future, as we are promised Holy Spirit in that day . The out pouring mentioned in Joel,
so we will be well fortified when it comes time for that final test.

We will know it when it happens, as there will be no holding us back.
So take courage and lean on Jah and He will be Our Stonghold and we will be witnesses to the sanctification of His Holy Name

much love
stayawake

[Sketch]

My question is if you are being tortured unimaginably in an attempt to get you to say or deny the existance of God.[/b]

you also need to define "unimaginable torture" - which kinda defeats the purpose (imagining the unimaginable?)... I consider the concentration camps torture to some degree... the medical experiments, etc... the folks in Malawi... these floks have all set the bar pretty high as to the punishment they took without cracking... but we&#39;re all different and have different levels that we can handle...

[Jeshurun]

Stayawake as usual your words are golden.

Sketch I agree with you about how only can Jehovah can judge whether or not we have been mentally taken-over. Mind-control technology using low-frequency electronic pulses is very real and something else to think about.

Gabriel, my brother. Today&#39;s text was perfect for this occasion. The key is to not be afraid of death. If you&#39;re ever in a position where someone is about to torture you to get you to renounce Jehovah, that would mean that you&#39;ve done a pretty good job up to that point. I recall Paul saying something about welcoming persecution, as that was reinforcement in his mind that he was doing the right thing, according to what Jesus taught him.

I believe that Jehovah knows how much pain we can bear, and I believe deep in my heart that if necessary, he will provide something like morphine to help us. Nothing is impossible for the Holy Spirit.

[Nambo]

I read that the persecuted Brothers in Africa would feel the first blow, but would feel nothing after that, the Holy Spirit will be sure to help you if you are suffering such things for the Christ.

A lot of the fear of torture is the sense of loss, ie, having your eyes burnt out, not only hurts bad, but you will never get to see anything again!, how will you live without your eyes?
Well, I hardly have to state the old for new assurance that we know we have for Jehovah, anything we lose for his sake, we will have returned, but in perfect condition.

"Yeah, go on, cut me legs off, they are too thin anyway"

[Gabriel]

Hey, Thanks guys. Your responces were awesome. I wanted to ask this question because im sure its one that we&#39;ve all thought about more than once...you know...the ol&#39; "What if...." its very incouraging to get others view regarding this matter and the faith thats expressed regarding Jehovah enabling us to endure the un-endurable. Love you guys.